• Advertisement
Karcher

Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

This is a free speech zone where you can discuss and debate everything Cambodia related. Cambodia Speakeasy is Cambodia's leading expat discussion forum.

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby batshitcrazyweirdo » Thu Dec 07, 2017 6:58 pm

Spigzy wrote:I'm not denying for employers that don't already have schemes in place that this is a good thing - absolutely has my support, look after the little guy!

What I'm saying is, imagine that factory is already run by an employee conscious employer, and already pays $10 per month for each employee. Assume that factory has 2,000 staff. So each month the employer health insurance premium is $20k - they, and their staff are happy with an above NSSF quality insurance cover. Now that employer has no choice but to up that bill to $24k per month; so across a year that's an increase of $48k on what they were paying previously.. might not break the bank, but it isn't peanuts either.

The employer either sucks that up and the employee gets dual cover & puts up the price of a pair of H&M boots to cover it, or they'll drop the private health cover & run the risk of upsetting their employees who no longer have as good cover as they had before & just pay the NSSF.

Surely an employer should be able to demonstrate cover at a higher level for all their staff & not have to pay NSSF? Or maybe they could have a hybrid of private cover as a retention incentive for more senior staff, and keep new joiners or junior staff on the basic NSSF? There's no flexibility in this scheme; should be mandatory for crap employers that don't provide private schemes, but decent employers with existing top notch schemes for staff - why penalise them?


Playboy wrote:
the chicken wrote: ... Is the coverage similar for employees at workplace?

No it is not.

#Post3/3ParityAchived


Post 56 million and you should come out and post something, Playgirl!
I love bitches, n rehabilitate witches.
User avatar
batshitcrazyweirdo
Batshit Crazy Weirdo
 
Posts: 8879
Joined: Wed May 27, 2015 3:24 pm
Location: Bat Cave

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby Lucky Lucan » Thu Dec 07, 2017 7:24 pm

the chicken wrote:At a school my kid studies at we had to pay $25 a year for insurance. For minor accident or sickness maximum payout is $500, in the event of death max payout is $5000. Is the coverage similar for employees at workplace?


No, it pays for government hospital fees. It's only for accident cover while at work or commuting to and from there.If you are hospitalized for a month it will pay 70% of your salary. If you die you get 4 million Riel and your parents will get compensation every 3 months until you die, your spouse will get compensation every 3 months until they get married again, and your children will get a compensation until 18 if going to school or till 21 if not (?). I have no idea how much this compensation is. The information I got about this wasn't very clear and I didn't think it was worth bothering to clarify.
We all gotta duck..............when the shit hits the fan.
User avatar
Lucky Lucan
K440 Knight Captain
 
Posts: 17723
Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2011 12:24 pm
Location: The Pearl of the Orient

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby ReasonstobefearfulP3 » Thu Dec 07, 2017 9:10 pm

Spigzy wrote:I'm not denying for employers that don't already have schemes in place that this is a good thing - absolutely has my support, look after the little guy!

What I'm saying is, imagine that factory is already run by an employee conscious employer, and already pays $10 per month for each employee. Assume that factory has 2,000 staff. So each month the employer health insurance premium is $20k - they, and their staff are happy with an above NSSF quality insurance cover. Now that employer has no choice but to up that bill to $24k per month; so across a year that's an increase of $48k on what they were paying previously.. might not break the bank, but it isn't peanuts either.

The employer either sucks that up and the employee gets dual cover & puts up the price of a pair of H&M boots to cover it, or they'll drop the private health cover & run the risk of upsetting their employees who no longer have as good cover as they had before & just pay the NSSF.

Surely an employer should be able to demonstrate cover at a higher level for all their staff & not have to pay NSSF? Or maybe they could have a hybrid of private cover as a retention incentive for more senior staff, and keep new joiners or junior staff on the basic NSSF? There's no flexibility in this scheme; should be mandatory for crap employers that don't provide private schemes, but decent employers with existing top notch schemes for staff - why penalise them?


Yeah, I understand what you are saying. As I mentioned the income tax thresholds did go up last year so the difference for the NSSF is still actually a net gain.

In my experience, in most other countries that have a social security fund, it is not opt in.

I would also be quite surprised if there were that many factories that pay private health care
ReasonstobefearfulP3
I've got nothing better to do
 
Posts: 89
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:47 pm

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby Pu Li » Fri Dec 08, 2017 1:47 am

ReasonstobefearfulP3 wrote:
Spigzy wrote:I'm not denying for employers that don't already have schemes in place that this is a good thing - absolutely has my support, look after the little guy!

What I'm saying is, imagine that factory is already run by an employee conscious employer, and already pays $10 per month for each employee. Assume that factory has 2,000 staff. So each month the employer health insurance premium is $20k - they, and their staff are happy with an above NSSF quality insurance cover. Now that employer has no choice but to up that bill to $24k per month; so across a year that's an increase of $48k on what they were paying previously.. might not break the bank, but it isn't peanuts either.

The employer either sucks that up and the employee gets dual cover & puts up the price of a pair of H&M boots to cover it, or they'll drop the private health cover & run the risk of upsetting their employees who no longer have as good cover as they had before & just pay the NSSF.

Surely an employer should be able to demonstrate cover at a higher level for all their staff & not have to pay NSSF? Or maybe they could have a hybrid of private cover as a retention incentive for more senior staff, and keep new joiners or junior staff on the basic NSSF? There's no flexibility in this scheme; should be mandatory for crap employers that don't provide private schemes, but decent employers with existing top notch schemes for staff - why penalise them?


Yeah, I understand what you are saying. As I mentioned the income tax thresholds did go up last year so the difference for the NSSF is still actually a net gain.

In my experience, in most other countries that have a social security fund, it is not opt in.

I would also be quite surprised if there were that many factories that pay private health care


Any astute employer would just decrease his contribution by $2, put that on the workers salary and show his employees that their coverage hasn't changed.
Pu Li
I live above an internet cafe
 
Posts: 208
Joined: Sun Oct 30, 2016 4:57 pm

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby ផោមក្លិនស្អុយ » Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:01 am

Pu Li wrote:
ReasonstobefearfulP3 wrote:
Spigzy wrote:I'm not denying for employers that don't already have schemes in place that this is a good thing - absolutely has my support, look after the little guy!

What I'm saying is, imagine that factory is already run by an employee conscious employer, and already pays $10 per month for each employee. Assume that factory has 2,000 staff. So each month the employer health insurance premium is $20k - they, and their staff are happy with an above NSSF quality insurance cover. Now that employer has no choice but to up that bill to $24k per month; so across a year that's an increase of $48k on what they were paying previously.. might not break the bank, but it isn't peanuts either.

The employer either sucks that up and the employee gets dual cover & puts up the price of a pair of H&M boots to cover it, or they'll drop the private health cover & run the risk of upsetting their employees who no longer have as good cover as they had before & just pay the NSSF.

Surely an employer should be able to demonstrate cover at a higher level for all their staff & not have to pay NSSF? Or maybe they could have a hybrid of private cover as a retention incentive for more senior staff, and keep new joiners or junior staff on the basic NSSF? There's no flexibility in this scheme; should be mandatory for crap employers that don't provide private schemes, but decent employers with existing top notch schemes for staff - why penalise them?


Yeah, I understand what you are saying. As I mentioned the income tax thresholds did go up last year so the difference for the NSSF is still actually a net gain.

In my experience, in most other countries that have a social security fund, it is not opt in.

I would also be quite surprised if there were that many factories that pay private health care


Any astute employer would just decrease his contribution by $2, put that on the workers salary and show his employees that their coverage hasn't changed.

I don’t think health insurance providers will let you arbitrarily reduce the price of the policy by 20%. They are normally quite astute too.
ផោមក្លិនស្អុយ
I Am Losing It All to the Internet
 
Posts: 1346
Joined: Sun Feb 05, 2017 4:42 pm

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby the chicken » Fri Dec 08, 2017 8:47 am

I tried reading Epedemik's link but it is all in Khmer, my Khmer reading comprehension is only good enough for karaoke, when clicked in English it talked about something else.

So from the info of this thread, it is compulsory for employers to pay their employees health insurance. Is there a specific link where it says that so I can show it to my employer. The amount of tax I have paid so far probably could get me 2 Honda Dreams. And I am confused about the $2 and $10 thing, how much exactly percentage wise does employer have to pay and employee if any. If there is any official link to this would be appreciated.
the chicken
I live above an internet cafe
 
Posts: 213
Joined: Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:25 am

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby ReasonstobefearfulP3 » Fri Dec 08, 2017 10:23 am

the chicken wrote:I tried reading Epedemik's link but it is all in Khmer, my Khmer reading comprehension is only good enough for karaoke, when clicked in English it talked about something else.

So from the info of this thread, it is compulsory for employers to pay their employees health insurance. Is there a specific link where it says that so I can show it to my employer. The amount of tax I have paid so far probably could get me 2 Honda Dreams. And I am confused about the $2 and $10 thing, how much exactly percentage wise does employer have to pay and employee if any. If there is any official link to this would be appreciated.



The best I know of is this:
https://prake.org/home/labour-law/social-security/national-social-security-fund

Employer pays all, employee not liable for any of the NSSF.

NSSF does have its own website but details are pretty scarce. The official bee is 0.8% of assumed wage (going up in 50,000 riel blocks to a maximum of 1m riel meaning $2 is the maximum)

How much tax have you paid so far? the max rate is 20% which kicks in at 1.25m riel. A salary of $2.5k a month will net you a tax of around $240 (for a Cambodian tax resident), I think that is pretty reasonable.

The salary tax here is all quite straight forward

I don't know where $10 came from
ReasonstobefearfulP3
I've got nothing better to do
 
Posts: 89
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:47 pm

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby ReasonstobefearfulP3 » Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:08 am

Reading the new Prakas it looks as though the $10 is coming from the second part of the NSSF, an additional 2.6% on top of the 0.8% that is going to be due from 1 Jan 2018. I do not know if this is capped at the same level as the NSSF payment (I would assume so).

That would bring the total due to roughly $8.50 (which now does seem like more of a burden on the company)
ReasonstobefearfulP3
I've got nothing better to do
 
Posts: 89
Joined: Fri Oct 14, 2016 4:47 pm

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby Spigzy » Fri Dec 08, 2017 11:59 am

The other issue not so much financial is that the level of cover provided is simply for state hospitals, etc - and experience on the ground is that despite being covered by NSSF, an employee will still have to negotiate fees with the hospital/doctor before treatment. If you take away even the most basic private cover and replace it with this, you'll end up with a lot of unhappy staff - I think most employers will simply have to bite the bullet and treat NSSF as a stealth tax.
Meum est propositum in taberna mori,
ut sint Guinness proxima morientis ori.
tunc cantabunt letius angelorum chori:
"Sit Deus propitius huic potatori."
User avatar
Spigzy
Hoff FanBoy
 
Posts: 3823
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:52 am

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby the chicken » Fri Dec 08, 2017 5:55 pm

I hear you Spigzy. My father in law just last month stayed a provincial hospital aka public hospital for 2 nights and set him back $450, thats a gigantic amount for a rice farmer and we each had to chip in. Do you know of any affordable private insurance in an event of an emergency Spig? A true insurance provider that is.
the chicken
I live above an internet cafe
 
Posts: 213
Joined: Sat Jul 22, 2017 10:25 am

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby Osiris » Sun Dec 10, 2017 8:04 am

the chicken wrote:I hear you Spigzy. My father in law just last month stayed a provincial hospital aka public hospital for 2 nights and set him back $450, thats a gigantic amount for a rice farmer and we each had to chip in. Do you know of any affordable private insurance in an event of an emergency Spig? A true insurance provider that is.


The true private insurance policy topic has come up where I work. If you know of anyone that is a broker, please advise.
Please don't tell my momma I work in a oil patch. She think's I'm a piano player in a ho house.
User avatar
Osiris
I've got nothing better to do
 
Posts: 83
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2016 12:26 pm

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby jackrossi » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:35 am

If the maximum payout for an accident is 500$ from the government scheme you could get an insurance that only covers expenses from 500$ to 10.000$ for example for your staff which combined should generally cover most expenses that your employees can occur at a government hospital. I think it should be quite cheap too.
User avatar
jackrossi
I Have Not Been Outside Today
 
Posts: 893
Joined: Sun Dec 08, 2013 8:29 pm

Re: Compulsory health insurance for foreigners.

Postby Spigzy » Tue Dec 12, 2017 1:23 pm

the chicken wrote:I hear you Spigzy. My father in law just last month stayed a provincial hospital aka public hospital for 2 nights and set him back $450, thats a gigantic amount for a rice farmer and we each had to chip in. Do you know of any affordable private insurance in an event of an emergency Spig? A true insurance provider that is.


PKMI deal with low premium basic health insurance (https://www.prevoir.asia/) - certainly designed more for locals than expats.
Meum est propositum in taberna mori,
ut sint Guinness proxima morientis ori.
tunc cantabunt letius angelorum chori:
"Sit Deus propitius huic potatori."
User avatar
Spigzy
Hoff FanBoy
 
Posts: 3823
Joined: Thu Feb 02, 2012 9:52 am

Previous

Return to Cambodia Speakeasy




Who is online

Users browsing this forum: HaramBarang, krungtep, LaudJohn, logos, Prahok, sattroni, Thrifty, TRM, upstage and 232 guests