It's a clicker, that's for sure.violet wrote:I love this train wreck of a thread.
2 Destitute Brits Sleeping Rough Outside Embassy
I told you to step aside because you were whinging about too many people involved and making snide comments towards those trying to help -- basically through the entirety of the thread. Totally pointless. I never said you should not express your views on the situation as to whether he deserved help or not. Just stop attacking people who want to help. Then again personal attacks seem to be a one way street on this forum.LTO wrote:He told me I am also supposed to "step aside", and I have never said anything like suggesting somebody die. I'm supposed to "step aside" because I suggested that before they start contacting family and giving hospital instructions for a man in a coma, they should try to contact and coordinate with the embassy which apparently was already doing those things. It appears that anybody that doesn't fully support RainDog's approach is supposed to "step aside" and be quiet. http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/view ... 70#p658706gavinmac wrote:No, you told the posters who opined that it would be best if he died to "step aside." You said that in your opinion they shouldn't post such opinions in this widely read thread and should instead post them in (another?) thread. You even invoked the name of the K440 admin in making this plea:Rain Dog wrote:I have never said that. I have simply said that people in disagreement as to checking on the guy should stop sniping at people and making silly accusations like it is racist to help because the person involved is white.Rain Dog wrote:6) As to the "He should just die" crowd, I really think it is time to step aside. Obviously this is up to k440 admin, but IMHO better left to another thread.
Taxi, we'd rather walk. Huddle a doorway with the rain dogs The Rum pours strong and thin. Beat out the dustman with the Rain Dogs; Oh, how we danced and you Whispered to me ... You'll never be going back home
Partial Lyrics - Tom Waits
Partial Lyrics - Tom Waits
- The third man
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Good reply to Andy' s question (and mine). I stand corrected.
Thank you.The third man wrote:Good reply to Andy' s question (and mine). I stand corrected.
I am going to sleep.
Taxi, we'd rather walk. Huddle a doorway with the rain dogs The Rum pours strong and thin. Beat out the dustman with the Rain Dogs; Oh, how we danced and you Whispered to me ... You'll never be going back home
Partial Lyrics - Tom Waits
Partial Lyrics - Tom Waits
Today's date : April 15.
by Charles Dashwood » Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:31 pm
by Charles Dashwood » Fri Mar 20, 2015 12:31 pm
Charles Dashwood [b]Fri Mar 20[/b], 2015 12:31 pm wrote:To clear up a few things:
1) Is the KT a joke? I don't think this needs to be answered.
2) Are the two backpapers foolish twats? Unquestionably yes.
3) Are they lying? No
4) Do they deserve the treatment they are getting. Probably not.
I have it on vaguely good authority that the original story should have been a much improved version of this;
Two British backpackers have been repeatedly refused assistance by their embassy to fly home despite having all their possessions stolen and being left penniless. Their situation is so dire that they have effectively been living as vagrants on the streets of Phnom Penh for the last two weeks.
Mr. Martin Gates, 24, and Mr. Nicholas Mclernan, 40 were staying in a hostel in Sihanoukville when their bags, and those of almost everybody staying in the dorm, were stolen in the middle of the night February 21. They lost $3,000 in cash, a MacBook, two smart phones, bank cards, and all their clothes barring those on their backs.
Travelling without insurance, Mr. Gates arranged for his step-father and mother to wire him a $200 dollar loan so that they could travel to the British Embassy in Phnom Penh to seek assistance. Over the course of more than three weeks, they visited the embassy three times and were told that the embassy could do nothing more than attempt to contact family or relatives on their behalf, and that they could use one of the embassy’s two available computers to attempt to contact relatives or friends--with no money forthcoming, they soon found themselves sleeping rough.
“When I first visited the embassy I couldn’t believe that they wouldn’t help. I even suggested that I should get arrested, so I would at least be deported, but they told me I would simply be thrown in prison until I came up with the money,” said Mr. Mclernan.
“They said that if they helped us out, the next day they would have a 1,000 people outside the gates.”
Currently they are undernourished, severely distressed, and sleeping outside under a small sheet. Mr. Gate’s who suffers from PTSD is riddled with mosquito bites, which appear to have become infected. The men have even taking to drinking water from taps in the street used to clean roads or water plants and duly suffered attendant sicknesses.
On contacting his bank (Nat West), Mr. Mclernan found that up to 15,000 pounds had been removed from his bank, through frequent withdrawals from ATMS as well as payments to iTunes and several other online platforms. At this point Mr. Mclernan did not freeze his account, believing it would effectively deny him access to his only remaining money.
One week ago, when sleeping in a park both men were woken by a security guard beating them with a baton. In the ensuing rush to escape to safety Mr. Mclernan lost his passport, a $15 dollar mobile phone he had purchased to make emergency calls, and his bank details. Nat West are now no longer able to give him any information on his account until he returns to London to prove his identity.
“I have been stupid, I know that and I wouldn’t tell anybody any different. I think about the mistakes we have made every day. I was upset after the theft but I honestly thought at least the embassy might help us get back home,” said Mr. Mclernan.
Mr. Gates is from a broken home and has been in and out of work since leaving school. His last business was building and selling bird houses for people’s gardens, but most recently has been claiming sickness benefit from a range of health problems. Mr. Mclernan is a chef by trade and used to work for Gala Casino as a hospitality manager, but has spent the last three years working as what he calls a ‘white van man’, primarily doing house removals.
Mclernan’s mother died last year and during our interview he frequently broke down in tears talking about it.
“I’d saved a bit of cash as I actually work hard in the UK and has a bit of inheritance from my mother, and Martin is my best mate and had a really tough year with his family. I thought it would be a treat for him, and what happened with my mum and everything. We just needed to get away for a bit.”
The British Embassy seems to have zero funds to help the two men and in an email to Khmer Times wrote: “The embassy does not have any funds to pay for flights for British Nationals who want to return home … It is the duty of individuals to take responsibility to take care for themselves.”
However this response does not appear to chime with the embassy’s own guidelines which stipulate, “A discretionary loan from public funds to help you return to the UK may only be considered in very exceptional circumstances and only if you have used up all other methods of getting funds.”
The two men went to the embassy for a fourth time accompanied by Khmer Times journalists and were finally given some clean shirts. However yet again the two men seemed to be treated badly and were not even given an opportunity to speak to a British member of staff. Embassy worker Sucheat Phang did not appear to have the most basic of training and spoke to the men in an aggressive manner, even going so far as finger jabbing at Mr. Mclernan, all on British territory.[/b]
Mr. Gates was hectored by embassy staff to phone his mother and demand funds, completely disregarding the fact that Mr. Gates largely grew up in care homes and has only recently established contact with his mother. Although it was 3am (British time) he did managed to get through to her. She was upset and worried, but sad that despite working three jobs, she barely had enough money to make ends meet. Immediately after the call, Gate’s broke down in tears.
Khmer Times journalists, however were able to speak with a British press officer who has very helpful, though she said she could not comment on specific cases, it was implied that work was going on behind the scenes to see if the men met the necessary requirements for the discretionary loan to fly home.
If anybody is in a position to help Martin and Nicholas please contact Khmer Times.
Bit different from what they originally published, yes?
Last edited by SCC on Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:50 am, edited 7 times in total.
K440 : Lucky cheese for the gentry; poultry and death for the peasants.
"Reading made Don Quixote a gentleman. Believing what he read made him mad."
"Reading made Don Quixote a gentleman. Believing what he read made him mad."
I not sure what point you're making SCC but if your post gets the thread back on track and about the story rather than the bickering of the last few pages, good on you. The media's lack of interest in the story is baffling. We sent the MailonSunday journalist who contacted Raven the various numbers to call and zilch happened. PPP were approached asking why they aren't interested. Zilch. Khmer Times have been asked several times why they pulled the story and they refuse to reply, but that is to be expected of them I suppose.
I even sent the story to the Bournemouth Echo, the local newspaper where the guys live. Nada. Not interested. I guess there was a local vicars tea party that needed coverage instead.
I even sent the story to the Bournemouth Echo, the local newspaper where the guys live. Nada. Not interested. I guess there was a local vicars tea party that needed coverage instead.
I'm re reading the entire thread to remind myself what is what. I have yet to speak with Nick, or Charles in person.
I decided to remind everyone what we know so far. I believe them. They were robbed, beaten, pointed at by a Cambodian official working at the embassy, and left to hang out and dry in a foreign country.
All because the embassy 'discriminated' against them as those they lumped in as being like them.
They even forced the younger one that was on sickness benefits for PTSD, after god knows what kind of life he had had being brought up in care homes, to phone his very recently recontacted mother to ask for money to be sent. etc.etc.etc.
It's a Mike Leigh/ Ken Loach scandal.
I decided to remind everyone what we know so far. I believe them. They were robbed, beaten, pointed at by a Cambodian official working at the embassy, and left to hang out and dry in a foreign country.
All because the embassy 'discriminated' against them as those they lumped in as being like them.
They even forced the younger one that was on sickness benefits for PTSD, after god knows what kind of life he had had being brought up in care homes, to phone his very recently recontacted mother to ask for money to be sent. etc.etc.etc.
It's a Mike Leigh/ Ken Loach scandal.
by Charles Dashwood » Fri Mar 20, 2015 2:42 pm
Chuck Wow wrote:
Charles Dashwood wrote:
I have personally escorted them to the embassy and given them fucking hell. No fucks given. Have I done enough for you?
Fuck me, someone call Fleetstreet we have a real journo hear.....
The whole story and your involvement smells of more bullshit than a rentboys cock.
Chuck, it's obviously up to you to believe whether I'm lying or being naive. They are both fuck ups, who have been involved in some scandalously fucked up decision making. I'm trying to help them. They both slept at my house last night. Its my opinion that the embassy is leaving them to hang out to dry. It's yours that they are stupid, lying idiots who deserve what they get. Let's just disagree and not resort to name calling, eh...
Last edited by SCC on Wed Apr 15, 2015 7:55 am, edited 4 times in total.
K440 : Lucky cheese for the gentry; poultry and death for the peasants.
"Reading made Don Quixote a gentleman. Believing what he read made him mad."
"Reading made Don Quixote a gentleman. Believing what he read made him mad."
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yes i think the analogy and implication is unfair and much too loose...Rain Dog wrote:At a personal level I would probably be more "sympatico" to someone closer to my own situation (e.g., from my own country or the area I am from). So yes reading about a Nigerian in this situation would have less effect than reading about someone from say the city I grew up in. This again is human nature. It is not racist
we connect with situations for a whole myriad of reasons...sometimes very personal and other times circumstantial....not something to be judged from a distance and especially when it involves acts of charity...
He's been in his room 35 years...time to let him out!
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This was taken from the 18m overstay thread. Good old GavinMac.intime wrote:A number of members suggested that the OP should go to his Embassy for help,well I hope he isn't English because if he is then the British Embassy will do nothing for him.
Some time ago I had my Travel bag stolen which held everything that I needed,Money,Passport,Credit Cards,the whole issue.
After going to the Police and filling out the theft report,I then went to the British Embassy informed them what happened,they were not interested in anything I told them,they basically said that if I had no money to pay up front for a new Passport then they couldn't start to process it,I told them I could get some Money by the next Day but they still wouldn't start to process it unless I payed up front,but they would let me have one Phone call to England to get someone to wire me some Money,I informed the guy in case he had forgotten that it was 3am in England and my sister is elderly,then he said in that case there is nothing he could do.
If anyone is unfortunate enough to require some help from the British Embassy then they are in for a shock.
I'd also like to take this opportunity to say it again...APPARENTLY...Humility is not something one can learn in Cambodia.
"Life is 10% what happens to me and 90% of how I react to it."
—Charles Swindoll
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Apart from a few people here on this forum that care what happens to this guy...Out in the real world no one cares. Most people these days have enough to do...just surviving and putting food on the table and paying the bills. Rightly or wrongly... there is really no sympathy from the average person for a drug addict in hospital in a third world country. IMHO that's why no media outlet or anyone else wants to know about it.Unfortunately this is what happens to people,who have burnt every person and every bridge in their life. True stories are usually the saddest.
Don't mention the Giant Panda in the room.
Deleted by SCC, as I don't want to get into flaming.
Last edited by SCC on Wed Apr 15, 2015 9:38 am, edited 1 time in total.
K440 : Lucky cheese for the gentry; poultry and death for the peasants.
"Reading made Don Quixote a gentleman. Believing what he read made him mad."
"Reading made Don Quixote a gentleman. Believing what he read made him mad."
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Not even the Mail? I think perhaps that should be taken as something of a reality check - a sobering indication that the notion there is something unusual, special or particularly unjust - ie newsworthy - about this situation may be unrealistic. I mean, take the word Cambodia out of the story, place this whole thing in the next country from where they live. I think even the most bleeding heart here can see why that is not news - found money, binge, crash, personal disaster, stranded. There is no man biting dog. It's just a sordid, rather distasteful tale of everyday lowlife. Now add the word Cambodia. Would that somehow make this seem unjust or special in the mind of the the average reader (or editor)? I would venture not. Same dog-bite-man everyday sordidness as the next county, just set in a dubious foreign shithole where this sort of thing is to be expected. So perhaps even less newsworthy, less sympathetic. I think there will be no outcry from home about this being some sort of injustice needing address. No calvary. If somebody is going to 'save' this guy, it'll have to be on the personal level by somebody like CD or SCC and/or within the dull confines of normal embassy policy. http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/view ... er#p657176scobienz wrote:I not sure what point you're making SCC but if your post gets the thread back on track and about the story rather than the bickering of the last few pages, good on you. The media's lack of interest in the story is baffling. We sent the MailonSunday journalist who contacted Raven the various numbers to call and zilch happened. PPP were approached asking why they aren't interested. Zilch. Khmer Times have been asked several times why they pulled the story and they refuse to reply, but that is to be expected of them I suppose.
I even sent the story to the Bournemouth Echo, the local newspaper where the guys live. Nada. Not interested. I guess there was a local vicars tea party that needed coverage instead.
I think you're right. The Mail contacted Raven on Friday and asked for phone numbers to call. They were sent those within 30 minutes of the request. Since then, nothing.LTO wrote: Not even the Mail? I think perhaps that should be taken as something of a reality check - a sobering indication that the notion there is something unusual, special or particularly unjust - ie newsworthy - about this situation may be unrealistic. I mean, take the word Cambodia out of the story, place this whole thing in the next country from where they live. I think even the most bleeding heart here can see why that is not news - found money, binge, crash, personal disaster. There is no man biting dog. It's just a sordid, rather distasteful tale of everyday lowlife. Now add the word Cambodia. Would that somehow make this seem unjust or special in the mind of the the average reader (or editor)? I would venture not. Same dog-bite-man everyday sordidness as the next county, just set in a dubious foreign shithole where this sort of thing is to be expected. So perhaps even less newsworthy, less sympathetic. I think there will be no outcry from home about this being some sort of injustice needing address. No calvary. If somebody is going to 'save' this guy, it'll have to be on the personal level by somebody like CD or SCC and/or within the dull confines of normal embassy policy. http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/view ... er#p657176
I'm surprised at the Bournemouth media though. I expected all kinds of hyperbolic headlines along the lines of "Bournemouth boys banged up in Cambo hellhole thanks t Brit bureaucrat bungling." Etc etc.
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