Why can’t Khmers translate into Khmer?
Why can’t Khmers translate into Khmer?
I’ve spoken to a number a Khmers (that speak English well), and asked them to translate a paragraph into Khmer. They’ve all reacted like I asked them to do an advanced calculus equation using a slide ruler.
If they speak English and understand those words, have been to college in Khmer, why can’t they translate a simple paragraph?
If they speak English and understand those words, have been to college in Khmer, why can’t they translate a simple paragraph?
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How many languages do you speak?
I am a native German speaker and speak pretty decent English and French. Ask me to translate from one into the other and I struggle. There isa reason that interpreters actualy study for their job.
I am a native German speaker and speak pretty decent English and French. Ask me to translate from one into the other and I struggle. There isa reason that interpreters actualy study for their job.
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I like Hanno's reply,
It tells a very simple story.
I have a son that speaks French as a first Language and English as a second.
My wife speaks Khmer as a first and English as a second.
I speak Australian ( which is not English, as I have been reminded on several occasions ) and struggle with Khmer as a spoken form of communication.
All these people can communicate very well in their first language - but not so good in there second language
So please tell me Mr Bogan why you expect to find someone that can communicate with you in both perfect Khmer and also in what ever version of English you are fluent in and can you also tell me how many languages you speak.?.
It tells a very simple story.
I have a son that speaks French as a first Language and English as a second.
My wife speaks Khmer as a first and English as a second.
I speak Australian ( which is not English, as I have been reminded on several occasions ) and struggle with Khmer as a spoken form of communication.
All these people can communicate very well in their first language - but not so good in there second language
So please tell me Mr Bogan why you expect to find someone that can communicate with you in both perfect Khmer and also in what ever version of English you are fluent in and can you also tell me how many languages you speak.?.
I refuse to go out with nothing more than a whimper followed by a small farting sound and a shit stain on my bed sheets..
Just thought I'd share that with you.
Just thought I'd share that with you.
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He prefaced it by saying Khmers who speak English well can't translate into Khmer. He's not complaining about Khmers who don't speak English, he's wondering why the can speak English but not translate into Khmer.
Have any of you ever handed a Khmer who speaks English fairly well a paragraph in Khmer and ask them to tell you generally what it says in English? They'll stare at the Khmer paragraph like its hieroglyphics for like a minute and a half before tentatively telling you what they think it says.
Honestly, I think if you asked them to tell you in Khmer what it said their response would be the same. I get the feeling they can't scan a paragraph in five seconds like we can and that reading Khmer is really difficult and time consuming, even for Khmers.
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Yes ^^. It's not an easy language to read, from what I see. I've also heard some heated arguments over how to write things properly. It seems as, because there is no spacing or punctuation, along with those funny squiggles that totally change sounds, no two people can actually agree on how to properly write more than a few sentences.
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Literacy is a major issue in Cambodia, Khmer literacy that is.
The level of written Khmer language that is taught in schools here is a very very basic level for the vast majority of the population.
Years back I had an elderly Khmer gentleman working with me, prior to the '70s he was a professor of languages, as well as that he spoke half a dozen fluently - English was his fifth language as it was flawless, both spoken and written. He would frequently comment how how appalled he was by the state of the Khmer language in the country, especially among the young professional Khmer staff we had.
- I am sure that u had a point to make before I started that paragraph ...
The level of written Khmer language that is taught in schools here is a very very basic level for the vast majority of the population.
Years back I had an elderly Khmer gentleman working with me, prior to the '70s he was a professor of languages, as well as that he spoke half a dozen fluently - English was his fifth language as it was flawless, both spoken and written. He would frequently comment how how appalled he was by the state of the Khmer language in the country, especially among the young professional Khmer staff we had.
- I am sure that u had a point to make before I started that paragraph ...
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You’re correct, my Khmer literacy and numeracy teacher said to me the other day, " I don't think your putting in enough effort"
Not true replied "I've been studying 24/7 five days a week"
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Spot on - apparently it can't be skim read easily like English, in all my professional career here I only found one who could skim read Khmer, and even then it wasn't at comparable speed to English skim reading - it wasn't a minute, but it wasn't five seconds either.gavinmac wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2019 6:06 pmHe prefaced it by saying Khmers who speak English well can't translate into Khmer. He's not complaining about Khmers who don't speak English, he's wondering why the can speak English but not translate into Khmer.
Have any of you ever handed a Khmer who speaks English fairly well a paragraph in Khmer and ask them to tell you generally what it says in English? They'll stare at the Khmer paragraph like its hieroglyphics for like a minute and a half before tentatively telling you what they think it says.
Honestly, I think if you asked them to tell you in Khmer what it said their response would be the same. I get the feeling they can't scan a paragraph in five seconds like we can and that reading Khmer is really difficult and time consuming, even for Khmers.
Meum est propositum in taberna mori,
ut sint Guinness proxima morientis ori.
tunc cantabunt letius angelorum chori:
"Sit Deus propitius huic potatori."
ut sint Guinness proxima morientis ori.
tunc cantabunt letius angelorum chori:
"Sit Deus propitius huic potatori."
Google Translate tells why:
- Translate from English to Khmer is pretty understandable, far from "normal" day to day Khmer, but comprehensible.
- Translate from Khmer to English gives a complete joke on results. Change one Khmer character and the whole translation does change from something stupid to something else stupid.
Or so to say, the Khmer writing does have quite a lot of interpretations. Even smart-ass 16 year old girly is not able to create a written Khmer sentence, which translates to something English, that can get her approval. Single words, yep, sentences, definitely not.
Combine that, with written and spoken Khmer being quite different and confusion is imminent.
- Translate from English to Khmer is pretty understandable, far from "normal" day to day Khmer, but comprehensible.
- Translate from Khmer to English gives a complete joke on results. Change one Khmer character and the whole translation does change from something stupid to something else stupid.
Or so to say, the Khmer writing does have quite a lot of interpretations. Even smart-ass 16 year old girly is not able to create a written Khmer sentence, which translates to something English, that can get her approval. Single words, yep, sentences, definitely not.
Combine that, with written and spoken Khmer being quite different and confusion is imminent.
Those bloody Viets should have made them change Khmer script to something more Latin looking when they had the chance.
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At least the script was modernized in the 60's. Some how that all slipped.
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It was the French who romanized the Viet script, they tried introducing a romanized script here in the 1940s but it was resisted by Sihanouk and the Sangha.
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I do expect every Cambodian I meet in Cambodia to be able to communicate in perfect (or close enough) Khmer - we’re in Cambodia. Is that too much to ask?scoffer wrote: ↑Tue Mar 05, 2019 4:58 pmI like Hanno's reply,
It tells a very simple story.
I have a son that speaks French as a first Language and English as a second.
My wife speaks Khmer as a first and English as a second.
I speak Australian ( which is not English, as I have been reminded on several occasions ) and struggle with Khmer as a spoken form of communication.
All these people can communicate very well in their first language - but not so good in there second language
So please tell me Mr Bogan why you expect to find someone that can communicate with you in both perfect Khmer and also in what ever version of English you are fluent in and can you also tell me how many languages you speak.?.
I’m not saying “why don’t cambodians speak better English” or “what the hell, I can’t understand these people”. I’m saying that I meet educated professionals that do speak English very well, and I wonder why they can’t then write in Khmer what they understand in English.
Come on Hanno, you’re telling me you couldnt read this paragraph in English, and then write it in German? And Scoffer, you couldn’t say something to your son in Australian, and he can’t write it in French? Bullshit.
As others have noted, there is a serious literacy problem here. Why is that? Is the language just doomed?
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If I were to translate khmer to english and I read "ក្រូចឆ្មា" in a full sentance, I'd wonder "wtf is an orange-cat ..." until I read it again, put it in full context and understand "shit, they meant lemon" and so on ...
That's just a simple example of how translating to or from Khmer can be really tedious.
P.S: The lack of space between words is riel.
That's just a simple example of how translating to or from Khmer can be really tedious.
P.S: The lack of space between words is riel.
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