Why is អញ so insulting?
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Why is អញ so insulting?
Or អា for that matter. I understand you can use them sometimes in intimate contexts, but I have used them wrong and had people flip out. Don't the two words really just mean "I" or essentially an article? Why are they so insulting?
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- MerkinMaker
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Because it's supposed to be used for children or people who are much younger (read lower status) than you, or that you are very intimate with, even in that case context is key.
Here's what the dictionary says:
It's fine as long as you put another pronoun in front of it. e.g. បងអញ. This is where most Khmer learners mess up, they hear it being used, but don't realize that the speaker is addressing themselves, or another pronoun that was added in front when addressing someone else.
Here's what the dictionary says:
A word used for addressing yourself or word used for young children, calling out for your young children. Or an old person calling for a young child, calling for a girl that they are close/intimate with or a senior person calling a subordinate that they are close/intimate with.អាញ់ ( បុ. ស. ) ខ្ញុំ (ជាអញ្ញត្រសព្ទ) ។ ពាក្យសម្រាប់ហៅខ្លួនឯង ជាសម្ដីកូនក្មេង និយាយទៅរកកូនក្មេងផងគ្នា ឬមនុស្សចាស់និយាយទៅរកកូនក្មេង, និយាយទៅរកមនុស្សស្មើភាពដែលស្និទ្ធស្នាល ឬក៏អ្នកធំនិយាយទៅរកអ្នកតូចដោយស្និទ្ធស្នាល
It's fine as long as you put another pronoun in front of it. e.g. បងអញ. This is where most Khmer learners mess up, they hear it being used, but don't realize that the speaker is addressing themselves, or another pronoun that was added in front when addressing someone else.
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- MerkinMaker
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Just to add to that, despite the dictionary definition, Cambodians generally only ever use this pronoun for others (no pronoun placed before it) when they are slagging them off behind their back or screaming at them.
I also found out the proper use of this word the hard way. I tend to learn just by copying what other people are saying, which works for me but occasionally causes a few embarrassing cock ups.
I also found out the proper use of this word the hard way. I tend to learn just by copying what other people are saying, which works for me but occasionally causes a few embarrassing cock ups.
Give អាឆ្កែនេះ a go - let us know how you get on
Meum est propositum in taberna mori,
ut sint Guinness proxima morientis ori.
tunc cantabunt letius angelorum chori:
"Sit Deus propitius huic potatori."
ut sint Guinness proxima morientis ori.
tunc cantabunt letius angelorum chori:
"Sit Deus propitius huic potatori."
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អា + adverb = a teasing derogatory remark - អាចាស់ for example
មានទឹកមានត្រីមានលុយមានស្រី
មានទឹកមានត្រីមានលុយមានស្រី
Mean Dtuk Mean Trey, Mean Loy Mean Srey
Punchy McShortstacks School of Hard Knocks
Punchy McShortstacks School of Hard Knocks
I can't read Khmer script, although I guess the OP is referring to "ah"? Would be helpful for those of us who can't read Khmer yet (I'm trying to learn, but I'm bloody useless!) if you could romanize the words also, thanks.
I'm not a negative person, I encourage people all the time...it's usually to f**k off! But, whatever.
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- MerkinMaker
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That is an example of something in Khmer that's almost impossible to romanize. Try joining these together quickly and you'll be close: a-eye-ny. The "a" needs to come from the back of the throat and not the top of the mouth like the Queens English.
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Yeah PSD, it's "ang". As in, "ang soob neing" (neak becomes neing, same as kniom changes to ang). Basically used when you're really angry and want to fight someone.
Unrelated, but since we're on the subject, there's also "ah" when used before a name. It's fine with close friends but becomes derogatory if angry and used with someone you don't like. For example, "ah kot", or "ah Seang". Ah is often used the same way as that "k" sound they'll put before words or names when pissed off. I don't think there's a written form for it. Example: kseang, or kmeng, kleak etc. Can't be done with names that start with k obviously and sounds weird with some other letters.
Unrelated, but since we're on the subject, there's also "ah" when used before a name. It's fine with close friends but becomes derogatory if angry and used with someone you don't like. For example, "ah kot", or "ah Seang". Ah is often used the same way as that "k" sound they'll put before words or names when pissed off. I don't think there's a written form for it. Example: kseang, or kmeng, kleak etc. Can't be done with names that start with k obviously and sounds weird with some other letters.
Thanks for your explanations guys
I'm not a negative person, I encourage people all the time...it's usually to f**k off! But, whatever.
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sorry Kiwi...Jamie_Lambo wrote:អា + adverb = a teasing derogatory remark - អាចាស់ for example
មានទឹកមានត្រីមានលុយមានស្រី
Ah + Adverb = a teasing or derogatory remark, example - Ah Chas(chah) - like calling someone an "old man" but used as more of an tease or insult rather than just pointing out they are old
Ah Mab - Fatty!
Ah Svet - Skinny!
Ah Chas - Old!
Ah Chkout - Crazy!
Ah Krak - Ugly!
etc..
Mean Dtuk Mean Trey, Mean Loy Mean Srey
Punchy McShortstacks School of Hard Knocks
Punchy McShortstacks School of Hard Knocks
I think you're confusing អញ and ឯង. អញ is ONLY a first-person pronoun (ពាក្យសម្រាប់ហៅខ្លួនឯង), never second. Also, និយាយទៅរក doesn't mean "call out for," it means "to address" (in this case, "when addressing children," etc., would be a better translation). in other words, អញ is the word (pronoun) you're using to refer to yourself when addressing children, subordinates, etc. ឯង is the second person pronoun you would use to address those people if you want to emphasize your social superiority (or your anger) over them (in that way, អញ/ឯង are a pair).starkmonster wrote:Because it's supposed to be used for children or people who are much younger (read lower status) than you, or that you are very intimate with, even in that case context is key.
Here's what the dictionary says:
A word used for addressing yourself or word used for young children, calling out for your young children. Or an old person calling for a young child, calling for a girl that they are close/intimate with or a senior person calling a subordinate that they are close/intimate with.អាញ់ ( បុ. ស. ) ខ្ញុំ (ជាអញ្ញត្រសព្ទ) ។ ពាក្យសម្រាប់ហៅខ្លួនឯង ជាសម្ដីកូនក្មេង និយាយទៅរកកូនក្មេងផងគ្នា ឬមនុស្សចាស់និយាយទៅរកកូនក្មេង, និយាយទៅរកមនុស្សស្មើភាពដែលស្និទ្ធស្នាល ឬក៏អ្នកធំនិយាយទៅរកអ្នកតូចដោយស្និទ្ធស្នាល
It's fine as long as you put another pronoun in front of it. e.g. បងអញ. This is where most Khmer learners mess up, they hear it being used, but don't realize that the speaker is addressing themselves, or another pronoun that was added in front when addressing someone else.
The construction បងអញ is ungrammatical (unless of course you're using អញ to show possession, in which case បងអញ would be "my older sister/brother", said to someone you feel socially superior to)...I think what you mean is បងឯង; when a kinship term precedes ឯង, it's a whole 'nother ball game, and instead of being haughty/lording your social superiority over someone, you're indicating a certain "warmth" in your relationship with them (so, យាយឯង or លោកគ្រូឯង are fine, for instance, if you feel close to the person).
At any rate, I always tell my students to never use អញ to refer to themselves, or ឯង alone to address others (unless they're part of a Khmer family and know "the rules" for it that way), no matter how good their Khmer gets (after 30 years, I still will not use either); for foreigners, the power dynamics are just too complex and the potential for serious offense is just too great.
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The potential for 'serious offense' is mostly among the uppity lower-middle to middle-middle classes, they seem the most status conscious.
I once, accidentally called one of the Deputy Prime Ministers 'oun' without noticing it, until someone else (not him) pointed it out. He himself thought it funny, and kept referring to me as Bong Playboy everytime he saw me subsequently.
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I once, accidentally called one of the Deputy Prime Ministers 'oun' without noticing it, until someone else (not him) pointed it out. He himself thought it funny, and kept referring to me as Bong Playboy everytime he saw me subsequently.
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"We, the sons of John Company, have arrived"
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