What will you do when you retire?
Time to write "7 reasons to open a bar in pp" and the inevitable follow - up.
A very good site I have also been using for a while. The most important point I think about saving for retirement is, rather than obsessing with a specific amount you will need, just concentrate on living below your means and saving and investing a significant percentage each month. You do this religiously for 30 years, then you will likely have enough to maintain the lifestyle that you had before retirement.gavinmac wrote:WallaceScott wrote:It's called compound interestFalcon Randwick wrote:30 million won times 20 years adds up to 600 million won, or did when I went to school, which I do every day.
Still only half a million dollars, no matter how long you look at it...
Right. The 25 year annual return for U.S. stocks (S&P 500) is about 10%.
If someone starts with a $10,000 nest egg and invests $1,000 a month, earning 8% a year, he'll have a million dollars after 25 years.
This early retirement forum is pretty good:
http://www.early-retirement.org/forums/
The biggest problems to success that I have seen are: 1) procrastination - you think you can always start later, 2) fear - jumping out of the markets with every panic, and 3-greed - wanting to get rich quick.
1) Procrastination. You always have tomorrow, you will be earning more later, you have so many bills now, you want to enjoy life while you are young, etc. etc. etc. But if you start saving from 25 to 35 you will have more money at 60 than if you save every year from 35 to 60. By way of example, assuming 8% return $5K annually invested from 25 through 35 results in around 616K while saving from 35 to 60 results in only about 432K. Again the power of compounding. Yes later you might earn more so invest more than 5K from 35 to 60, but you get the picture. The earlier you start the better compounding works. And 8% of 1000 is only %80, but 8% of $10,000 is $800, and 8% of $100,000 is $8000 a year. It starts to get very significant over time. And time is the one thing you cannot recover from, once lost, it is gone.
2) Fear. You are afraid to take any "risk" and by doing do you get greater actual risk, as inflation eats away your savings. You have friends that lost money in equities, or you read the financial news, etc. It keeps you away from owning stocks, and that is very harmful long term. The other aspect of fear is that if you do invest, as soon as you see your holdings drop 10%, 20%, 30% or more, you sell. Over the course of your investing career there will be many panics, if you sell in a panic you loose. So many people's retirement accounts were wiped out in the 2009 crash who needlessly sold during the panic.
3) Greed. Manics are as bad as panics. You see someone else making 200% on their investments, or read how you can too if you just follow this or that. Your 8% return seems pretty pathetic. Those that are not wiped out by fear, are wiped out by greed. Hey, you cannot get better than market returns long term, no matter what people tell you. Nobody does, and if you try, you are gambling not investing.
So then it is just a matter of picking an asset allocation (stocks, bonds, real estate, etc.) and an amount you can handle (minimum is probably %15 IF you start very early) and sticking to it. The problem for expats is often they cannot get as good investment opportunities as can residents of developed countries, say the U.S., with which I am the most familiar.
How to invest for expats in Cambodia or those that travel around a lot is something I know nothing about but is of critical importance. Hopefully someone else will weigh in on this.
Sorry for such a long post.
- Phuket2006
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how many people have an extra $1,000/month to invest for 25 years?
i'd say less than 1% that live in SE asia that are expats
These are figures that apply to living in the west
i'd say less than 1% that live in SE asia that are expats
These are figures that apply to living in the west
"We are turning into a nation of whimpering slaves to Fear—fear of war, fear of poverty, fear of random terrorism, or suddenly getting locked up in a military detention camp on vague charges of being a Terrorist sympathizer." HST
Nonsense. Given the number of executives working in places like Singapore, Thailamd and Indonesia - let alone cambodia - the number of solvent and earning expats is closer to at least 30 percent or more.
I know maybe a dozen expats well here including numerous 440ers. Pretty much all of them would be capable of saving at least 1000 a month.
I know maybe a dozen expats well here including numerous 440ers. Pretty much all of them would be capable of saving at least 1000 a month.
Depends on your living standards of course, but in Cambodia that would seem to be reasonable, vlad.
In other parts of SEA - Phuket's point - it would be different.
People always fall into the trap of thinking the only expats in SEA are retirees and - no offence meant - relatively low paid English teachers. That is simply not the case, neither in Cambodia now and obviously not the case in more mature markets like Thailand and Singapore.
In other parts of SEA - Phuket's point - it would be different.
People always fall into the trap of thinking the only expats in SEA are retirees and - no offence meant - relatively low paid English teachers. That is simply not the case, neither in Cambodia now and obviously not the case in more mature markets like Thailand and Singapore.
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The 1% number is nonsense, the 30% number may be way too high though. There are a shot load of expat retirees, English teachers, methheads, volunteers, Mormons, disability pensioners, Nigerian hustlers, etc. who aren't saving $1000 a month. Scoring tends to view things from his BKK international firm bubble and discounts the reality that the majority of expats live in squalor.
But let's keep in mind that any expat working ng at an embassy can save $1000 plus a month because they get free housing and meals and whatnot.
Anyway, I'd guess it's in the 20-30% range in Phnom Penh. Way lower everywhere else, especially Sihanoukville.
But let's keep in mind that any expat working ng at an embassy can save $1000 plus a month because they get free housing and meals and whatnot.
Anyway, I'd guess it's in the 20-30% range in Phnom Penh. Way lower everywhere else, especially Sihanoukville.
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I said 30% for the entire SEA region, which includes much more advanced markets which attract more professionals, directly on point to Phuket's claim.
I would say the figure in Cambodia is closer to 20-25%, largely diluted by GM's beloved Sihanoukville deathpats. I would remind him, though, that the vast majority of expats in Cambodia live in Phnom Penh, and are rarely seen outside his three block bubble of Garage Bar, Larrys (most of whom's patrons would like be able to save $1000 a month, by the way) and Street 104. That's why he has never seen them.
I would say the figure in Cambodia is closer to 20-25%, largely diluted by GM's beloved Sihanoukville deathpats. I would remind him, though, that the vast majority of expats in Cambodia live in Phnom Penh, and are rarely seen outside his three block bubble of Garage Bar, Larrys (most of whom's patrons would like be able to save $1000 a month, by the way) and Street 104. That's why he has never seen them.
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30% for the entire SEA region would include the 20000+ in Singapore. This would dilute the number considerably.scobienz wrote:I said 30% for the entire SEA region, which includes much more advanced markets which attract more professionals, directly on point to Phuket's claim.
I would say the figure in Cambodia is closer to 20-25%, largely diluted by GM's beloved Sihanoukville deathpats. I would remind him, though, that the vast majority of expats in Cambodia live in Phnom Penh, and are rarely seen outside his three block bubble of Garage Bar, Larrys (most of whom's patrons would like be able to save $1000 a month, by the way) and Street 104. That's why he has never seen them.
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OK for SE Asia you're right, lots in Singapore and all could save that much
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ok i agree 1% is way low,
i would venture closer to 20%
but still that's 80% that cant
To save that u would need to be taking home ( depending on where you live) not just making
$3,000-5,000/month
BUT most people that earn a lots also spend alot
so i seriously doubt anyone taking home $2,500/month will save $1,000 out of that
PLUS to do that over 10 straight years!
I had some years i saved $100,000, some i lost double that
i would venture closer to 20%
but still that's 80% that cant
To save that u would need to be taking home ( depending on where you live) not just making
$3,000-5,000/month
BUT most people that earn a lots also spend alot
so i seriously doubt anyone taking home $2,500/month will save $1,000 out of that
PLUS to do that over 10 straight years!
I had some years i saved $100,000, some i lost double that
"We are turning into a nation of whimpering slaves to Fear—fear of war, fear of poverty, fear of random terrorism, or suddenly getting locked up in a military detention camp on vague charges of being a Terrorist sympathizer." HST
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Better off buying condos over that same period and living off the rental fees later in life. Property is never worth zero, unlike some retirement accounts.
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Why are the gods such vicious cunts?
Where is the god of tits and wine?
Why are the gods such vicious cunts?
Where is the god of tits and wine?
As I mentioned in my post, it is not important to obsess over any single number, decide on a percentage and save that each month. After all, your retirement amount is based on the amount you spent during your working years. Those living in some high cost areas in some professions making $5000 to $10000 a month will need a different dollar amount of retirement savings than those living in low cost situations where they live on $1000 a month.Phuket2006 wrote:how many people have an extra $1,000/month to invest for 25 years?
i'd say less than 1% that live in SE asia that are expats
These are figures that apply to living in the west
And remember my first reason for not saving enough is Procrastination. Under that falls, "reasons why I cannot save right now", I don't make enough, I don't believe a person in my situation can do it, I don't believe the math on compounding, etc., etc. Hey if a Vermont gas station attendant and janitor who recently died at age 92 can amass $8 million, everyone can save something.
Don't let procrastination, or belief that it cannot be done, stop you from starting. It can be done, but it won't if you don't start.