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Believe it or not, there is a whole other world outside of Cambodia and South East Asia, be it people or politics, frustrations or football, this is the place to talk about it.
Normal women are women who are not third wave/fourth wave feminists. They are women who have a grip on reality, are not narcissistic and mistakenly entitled. Third wave/fourth wave feminists are seriously damaging what previous generations of women/feminists have accomplished.
By encouraging young women to re-define the Aziz situation as sexual assault you do a great disservice to women who have suffered serious sexual assault.
And by the way, the cotton ceiling and MtF transgenders appropriating women's spaces and bodies has everything to do with male privilege, boundaries and women being socialized to be agreeable.
Nirvana wrote:HPUM, this isn't the victim Olympics. It's 2018 and men in western countries have agency. If a date is uncomfortable because you're deliberately ignoring their boundaries to see how far you can push in a situation then stop. Simple.
So you're saying no woman has ever been/will ever be coy again, has never/will never play hard to get again?
Where does one draw the line, and how would one know? Seriously.
I think even you would admit that many times, when a woman says no, she means yes.
I sometimes see my wife looking a bit miffed; I ask her what's wrong? She replies: 'NOTHING!'
Only an idiot would believe that she MEANS nothing.
My point is in relationships and dating, people often lie or are less than 100% honest...so how would one know when No means No or maybe, apart from the obvious cases/limits?
Normal women are women who are not third wave/fourth wave feminists. They are women who have a grip on reality, are not narcissistic and mistakenly entitled.
And they take Tomoe Gozen as their role model, particularly remembering her conduct at the battle of Awazu.
Most North American women are not even familiar with such prominent Japanese historical figures like Tokugawa Ieyasu. I seriously doubt that even 10% of people in North America are familiar with a more obscure person like Tomoe Gozen.
Harold wrote:Most North American women are not even familiar with such prominent Japanese historical figures like Tokugawa Ieyasu. I seriously doubt that even 10% of people in North America are familiar with a more obscure person like Tomoe Gozen.
Exactly , and probably unfamiliar with the exploits of Buffalo Calf Road Woman or Dahteste. I don't think that most women in the majority world are aware of the obscure ideologies of a percentage of North American women.
I realise that India and China has the highest percentage of women that identify as feminist but the definition of feminist is someone who advocates and supports equal opportunities for women, rather than the extreme rhetoric of third and fourth wave feminist dogma held by some women in the US.
Nirvana wrote:
That she legally consented to sexual activity isn't the issue. And you know that. Or if you don't, well, you're probably somebody's Aziz Ansari.
That is the only thing that matters, regret is not rape and all that.
He apologized to her, and then he publicly emphasized that it was technically consent. Why did he do both those things? Cause he knew exactly what he was doing. He just had hoped she didn't.
As he didn't want his career ruined by some chick with regret?
Why on earth do men think it is perfectly fine to ignore women's boundaries and manipulatively pester them into sex just because it's not breaking the law?
Because it is perfectly fine as it doesn't break the rules we as a society made. If you think the rules are flawed then try and change them but don't blame people for following the rules. That is just silly.
Right. Cause Clinton is responsible for her husband's actions but 45 and Aziz Ansari aren't responsible for their own. Got it.
Though kudos for inadvertently dropping another white guy example I guess...
Why does the skin colour of any of the involved matter?
Right. Cause Clinton is responsible for her husband's actions but 45 and Aziz Ansari aren't responsible for their own. Got it.
Well, Hillary was never exactly an innocent bystander.
Should Hillary Clinton be held personally responsible for her husband’s misbehavior? No; it certainly wasn’t her biting Juanita Broaddrick’s lip in that hotel room 38 years ago. But she should be held responsible for attempting to discredit his victims, staying married to a probable serial sex abuser, and allowing said abuser to campaign on her behalf. She should be held accountable for allowing her surrogates to slut-shame and trash-shame her husband’s mistresses, and her personal record when it comes to sex abuse isn’t exactly stellar. (Jacqueline Long or Kathy Shelton, anyone?)
These people (ok, men) who abuse their gatekeeping position to demand sex, or anything else, are obviously loathsome and should be exposed.
Though I think people (ok, women) who use their sexual guile to get career advances they don't deserve should be similarly exposed.
But this Ansari thing is really rather pathetic.
"I got a really bad deal on that new car because the salesman was so convincing and insistent"
O K
I don't think you can talk about gender without talking about sex, and this whole movement is clearly a big power push for feminist women, who want sex, the way men ask for sex, etc, to be on their terms only.
Because sex is a resource that women have, and men want, and these games (and many other things) are easily explained in that context, and the economics of that.
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Last edited by electron on Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:09 am, edited 4 times in total.
Normal women are women who are not third wave/fourth wave feminists. They are women who have a grip on reality, are not narcissistic and mistakenly entitled. Third wave/fourth wave feminists are seriously damaging what previous generations of women/feminists have accomplished.
"Get off my lawn, kids!"
By encouraging young women to re-define the Aziz situation as sexual assault you do a great disservice to women who have suffered serious sexual assault.
I didn't say to call it sexual assault. Have you been paying attention? But it's still unacceptable and shitty. When cishet men are taught to ignore boundaries and cishet women are taught to be nicey-nice and understanding at their own expense *this* can happen. Do you know who Aziz Ansari is? He's not stupid, he knows better and he knows he knows better. He wrote a fucking book about it!
maven wrote:So you're saying no woman has ever been/will ever be coy again, has never/will never play hard to get again?
Where does one draw the line, and how would one know? Seriously.
Why do people keep ignoring the actual situation we're discussing and then substituting their own different one?
My point is in relationships and dating, people often lie or are less than 100% honest...so how would one know when No means No or maybe, apart from the obvious cases/limits?
Look. If you're on a date with a woman who makes clear you're making her uncomfortable but gives you the chance to show you're a good guy who'll respect her who actually says she doesn't want it to feel forced and to slow down, but you're preoccupied with your own sexual agenda, I can't help you. If you think that's the same as your wife being short or sarcastic when you ask what's wrong, I can't help you there either.
And here I thought this forum couldn't handle such a discussion.
Calling a man 'bald' is sex harassment after employment tribunal compares it to commenting on a woman's breasts... as electrician called 'bald c***'...