Indeed. The instant assumption that any suspected kiddy-fiddler has been set up is a tad disturbing, the obvious question is why? And the logical conclusion is ...gavinmac wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 6:04 amWhere did I assume he was guilty? I was simply challenging your statement that you were "pretty sure" he was set up.derf wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 3:17 am
Equally he could have pumped the girls all night so deserves a serious hammering, but we simply don't know, so that makes your assumption of guilt extremely insensitive and nothing more than an internet keyboard warrior job.
Yes, there are plenty of nasty sods out there that do mess with kids, but we don't know if he's one of them or not.
Tampa, Florida lawyer Rugh James Cline arrested in Cambodia on child sex charge
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ירי ילדים והפצצת אזרחים דורש אומץ, כמו גם הטרדה מינית של עובדי ההוראה.
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Some posters seem unaware of the legal system in Cambodia, particularly the role of the national police.
If the police are to enact a scam then it needs to be completed before the scammee is formally charged. Once charged the investigation is undertaken by the judiciary in the form of an investigating judge and custody is undertaken by the Prison Department under directions from the Judiciary (with assistance from judicial police); the national police are no longer involved in the matter and hence any funding opportunities are either severely curtailed or gone altogether (usually the latter).
Furthermore, pedophile cases involving foreigners attract much scrutiny from media, advocacy & protection groups, embassies and other interested parties, which further reduces opportunities for illicit funding.
This is not to say that a scam has not taken place, merely that cases involving foreigners charged with pedophilia tend to suffer less from the vagaries of the Cambodian justice system than do others brought before the courts.
This may help explain why many long-time residents of Cambodia are somewhat less cynical of such charges whilst on other matters their opinion of the judiciary is layered with misgivings.
If the police are to enact a scam then it needs to be completed before the scammee is formally charged. Once charged the investigation is undertaken by the judiciary in the form of an investigating judge and custody is undertaken by the Prison Department under directions from the Judiciary (with assistance from judicial police); the national police are no longer involved in the matter and hence any funding opportunities are either severely curtailed or gone altogether (usually the latter).
Furthermore, pedophile cases involving foreigners attract much scrutiny from media, advocacy & protection groups, embassies and other interested parties, which further reduces opportunities for illicit funding.
This is not to say that a scam has not taken place, merely that cases involving foreigners charged with pedophilia tend to suffer less from the vagaries of the Cambodian justice system than do others brought before the courts.
This may help explain why many long-time residents of Cambodia are somewhat less cynical of such charges whilst on other matters their opinion of the judiciary is layered with misgivings.
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I don’t think anyone for a moment believes that you are a Christian Cambodian woman that grew up here and moved to the US, where you happened to meet the suspect, and within one day of this post going up happened to stumble across it on the internet.Lonelyplanet wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:13 amThanks! Exactly my points. Some automatically presumed that he is a pedophile before he is even in trial; and choose to trust everything these girls said, ignoring all the red flags; all the illogic claims and signs; just because they said these girls are “children”. I do think children don’t lie. But these girls are near 15 yo; they are teenagers. These are not innocent children. And they are caught lying at least in one of the claims. If they are all honest in what they said, I’ll 100% support them.backhome wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2019 10:50 pmWhat about the presumption of innocence?gavinmac wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2019 12:02 pm
Well, that's the thing about child sex offenders. they all have friends and family members. And when they're arrested, often caught in the act, their friends and family rarely say "Oh, I suspected him all along." They invariably say "No way, he couldn't have, it's a set up!"
Before someone throws stones at me; I’m NOT saying that it is ok to have sex with them. I’m talking about the honesty of their statements.
I find it funny that some of you accusing me of defending a pedophile; while for the whole time I just try to point out that this man might be accused of something that he did not commit or at least unknowingly committed.
I could ask the same question; why are you defending liars?
Also, some of you disregard my valid questions and arguments; but rather trying to divert the arguments to invalid and irrelevant points such as whether or not I am not a Cambodia native as claimed and my link to the pedophiles (laughing here because in fact I am a woman - and I never said and also will never defend a pedophile). Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. And, don’t forget, at the end of the day, only Jesus Christ can judge.
Come on now, you’ve alluded that you know personal info about this. Do you live in Siem Reap? I have a feeling that you’ve posted on here before, haven’t you?
Check your very first post:
PERP: The perpetrator of a crime.gavinmac wrote: The American perp appears to be in his late 30's or early 40's and about 195 centimeters tall, or six feet, four inches.
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Lol. How is this related to the topic of discussion? You appear like a bitter loser, debating on an irrelevant fact instead of getting some valid points across. Be an educated adult.Miguelito wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 7:45 amI don’t think anyone for a moment believes that you are a Christian Cambodian woman that grew up here and moved to the US, where you happened to meet the suspect, and within one day of this post going up happened to stumble across it on the internet.Lonelyplanet wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 2:13 amThanks! Exactly my points. Some automatically presumed that he is a pedophile before he is even in trial; and choose to trust everything these girls said, ignoring all the red flags; all the illogic claims and signs; just because they said these girls are “children”. I do think children don’t lie. But these girls are near 15 yo; they are teenagers. These are not innocent children. And they are caught lying at least in one of the claims. If they are all honest in what they said, I’ll 100% support them.backhome wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2019 10:50 pmWhat about the presumption of innocence?gavinmac wrote: ↑Sun Jun 02, 2019 12:02 pm
Well, that's the thing about child sex offenders. they all have friends and family members. And when they're arrested, often caught in the act, their friends and family rarely say "Oh, I suspected him all along." They invariably say "No way, he couldn't have, it's a set up!"
Before someone throws stones at me; I’m NOT saying that it is ok to have sex with them. I’m talking about the honesty of their statements.
I find it funny that some of you accusing me of defending a pedophile; while for the whole time I just try to point out that this man might be accused of something that he did not commit or at least unknowingly committed.
I could ask the same question; why are you defending liars?
Also, some of you disregard my valid questions and arguments; but rather trying to divert the arguments to invalid and irrelevant points such as whether or not I am not a Cambodia native as claimed and my link to the pedophiles (laughing here because in fact I am a woman - and I never said and also will never defend a pedophile). Everyone is entitled to their own opinions. And, don’t forget, at the end of the day, only Jesus Christ can judge.
Come on now, you’ve alluded that you know personal info about this. Do you live in Siem Reap? I have a feeling that you’ve posted on here before, haven’t you?
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What is your basis for saying in your first post that the girls are all related to each other? Did you read that somewhere or do you know them or are you just speculating without any basis in fact?Lonelyplanet wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:36 am
Lol. How is this related to the topic of discussion? You appear like a bitter loser, debating on an irrelevant fact instead of getting some valid points across. Be an educated adult.
Follow my lame Twitter feed: @gavin_mac
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The fact that you are obviously lying about your identity is very relevant.Lonelyplanet wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:36 am
Lol. How is this related to the topic of discussion? You appear like a bitter loser, debating on an irrelevant fact instead of getting some valid points across. Be an educated adult.
Romantic Cambodia is dead and gone. It's with McKinley in the grave.
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The very definition of a victim is also someone who is tricked , duped or helpless . These underage girls were not in this category. Your " very definition " is valid however they deliberately placed themselves for reward to become victims .Dallow Spicer wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2019 4:43 pmLucky Seven wrote: ↑Mon Jun 03, 2019 3:17 pmI'm inclined to agree with Horace that all Cambodian girls under 21 look under age and this alone should have been a turn off however , I don't see these girls as victims when they were repeatedly complicit and lonely planet presents a good argument.
Victims of Pedo's are trusting juveniles lured by the perverts but these underage girls it appears were most certainly not in that category .
Of course they're fucking victims. The verydefinition an underage girl is a child incapable of making informed decisions about such issues, irrespective of her behaviour.
My very definition of a victim would be a molested child not encouraging an offense.... e.g. alter boy / priest ....teacher / student . These trusting minors are victims not underage girls soliciting at night in pub street .
Anyway you think their victims , I don't but regardless of that if he's done the crime then he deserves to be appropriately punished.
Are there cases like this where, once the dust has settled, serious doubts remain over the perpetrator's guilt?
I don't think there are many. Although that one with the teacher a year or so ago accused of abusing one of his very young pupils always seemed a bit of a strange one.
But I would expect that for the reasons pointed out by Prahok, there are very few miscarriages of justice in this area.
I don't think there are many. Although that one with the teacher a year or so ago accused of abusing one of his very young pupils always seemed a bit of a strange one.
But I would expect that for the reasons pointed out by Prahok, there are very few miscarriages of justice in this area.
TheGrimReaper wrote: ↑Mon Sep 02, 2019 1:45 pmSlavedog, you do not belong on this forum as you talk too much sense.
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For those who accused me for not showing enough sympathy for these girls, let me explain why. If I feel that they are truly an innocent honest victim, I’d 100% support them. But I don’t even feel like they are even trust-worthy, leave alone being an innocent victim.
First of all, let’s discuss a bit about age of consent. Let me remind you, these girls are NOT children. They are teenagers. Who have been a parents will know the difference of a child and a teenager. Psychologically, a teenager can make conscious choice and apparently know what they are doing.
Proof? The age of consent in some European countries is 14.
See link below.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of ... ope#France
My friend from Vietnam told me, her parents were married at 13. Some part of the country, like in the mountain villages, people are still getting married at 15. Don’t believe me? Do your own research.
Ever wondered why the punishment for this type of crime in Cambodia is 1 - 3 yrs in prison and $2000 max in fine? Do your research.
The cultures are different around the globe.
Not supporting pedophiles or even for a second think that is ok; but I bring this up because I read a few comments who said it doesn’t matter what they did, who they are, regardless; just because of their age, no need to debate further because they are children. A 9yo or even 12yo are children. A teenager is not. Again, a teenager psychologically and even legally capable of making conscious choice. They can deliberately lie, commit crime and some are just as bad as “the adults”. Don’t believe it? 5 years ago, there was a murder of a whole family of 5 done by a 14 yo boy. I can share link; but I’m sure some of you have come across something like that, so do your own research if needed.
So to answer those who ask for leaving these girls out of question because they are “children”, let me ask you this, does it mean you would tolerate any crime a person made as long as he/she is under 18? Including murder? Including wrongly accuse of someone? No.
Age is not an indicator of maturity, nor characteristics. A 15 years old can lie. A 15 years old can commit crime. We are more likely to forgive them; and they are more likely to receive a lighter punishment. But that does not mean we disregard all evidence and blindly trust whatever they say. That means we still need to consider the evidence placed in front of us and put it in a fair perspective.
So move on to the next question, why do I doubt these girl.
First of all, the characteristics and the honesty of these girls are questionable. Besides all of points I mentioned in my other posts about them wandering alone at night; according to their own claims, this has happened 3 times. One of the girls actually introduced her cousin to the guy. If what they said is true, what does it sound like? It sounds like a young pimp in the making. Someone who can do that is apparently not a good girl, leave alone being innocent.
Second is the motive. According to these girls, he has had sex with them multiple times including one time in his trip in 2018. So why this only now came to the surface right about the time he was about to leave the country?
Third, for those who wonder, I happen to know more insider details because I am part of a Facebook music group that involve people who know him. No one for a second believes that he had done this. His family is desperately working to have him tried in the US. If he has committed this crime, why would they rather it be like that - knowing the punishment is way more severe over here. They want justice and a fair verdict.
First of all, let’s discuss a bit about age of consent. Let me remind you, these girls are NOT children. They are teenagers. Who have been a parents will know the difference of a child and a teenager. Psychologically, a teenager can make conscious choice and apparently know what they are doing.
Proof? The age of consent in some European countries is 14.
See link below.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of ... ope#France
My friend from Vietnam told me, her parents were married at 13. Some part of the country, like in the mountain villages, people are still getting married at 15. Don’t believe me? Do your own research.
Ever wondered why the punishment for this type of crime in Cambodia is 1 - 3 yrs in prison and $2000 max in fine? Do your research.
The cultures are different around the globe.
Not supporting pedophiles or even for a second think that is ok; but I bring this up because I read a few comments who said it doesn’t matter what they did, who they are, regardless; just because of their age, no need to debate further because they are children. A 9yo or even 12yo are children. A teenager is not. Again, a teenager psychologically and even legally capable of making conscious choice. They can deliberately lie, commit crime and some are just as bad as “the adults”. Don’t believe it? 5 years ago, there was a murder of a whole family of 5 done by a 14 yo boy. I can share link; but I’m sure some of you have come across something like that, so do your own research if needed.
So to answer those who ask for leaving these girls out of question because they are “children”, let me ask you this, does it mean you would tolerate any crime a person made as long as he/she is under 18? Including murder? Including wrongly accuse of someone? No.
Age is not an indicator of maturity, nor characteristics. A 15 years old can lie. A 15 years old can commit crime. We are more likely to forgive them; and they are more likely to receive a lighter punishment. But that does not mean we disregard all evidence and blindly trust whatever they say. That means we still need to consider the evidence placed in front of us and put it in a fair perspective.
So move on to the next question, why do I doubt these girl.
First of all, the characteristics and the honesty of these girls are questionable. Besides all of points I mentioned in my other posts about them wandering alone at night; according to their own claims, this has happened 3 times. One of the girls actually introduced her cousin to the guy. If what they said is true, what does it sound like? It sounds like a young pimp in the making. Someone who can do that is apparently not a good girl, leave alone being innocent.
Second is the motive. According to these girls, he has had sex with them multiple times including one time in his trip in 2018. So why this only now came to the surface right about the time he was about to leave the country?
Third, for those who wonder, I happen to know more insider details because I am part of a Facebook music group that involve people who know him. No one for a second believes that he had done this. His family is desperately working to have him tried in the US. If he has committed this crime, why would they rather it be like that - knowing the punishment is way more severe over here. They want justice and a fair verdict.
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How would friends of his in Florida know if the girls were all related? That's something someone based in Siem Reap familiar with underage prostitutes there would know.Lonelyplanet wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 9:59 am
Third, for those who wonder, I happen to know more insider details because I am part of a Facebook music group that involve people who know him. No one for a second believes that he had done this. His family is desperately working to have him tried in the US. If he has committed this crime, why would they rather it be like that - knowing the punishment is way more severe over here. They want justice and a fair verdict.
Follow my lame Twitter feed: @gavin_mac
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Fucking Rock lobster.Lonelyplanet wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 9:59 amFor those who accused me for not showing enough sympathy for these girls, let me explain why. If I feel that they are truly an innocent honest victim, I’d 100% support them. But I don’t even feel like they are even trust-worthy, leave alone being an innocent victim.
First of all, let’s discuss a bit about age of consent. Let me remind you, these girls are NOT children. They are teenagers. Who have been a parents will know the difference of a child and a teenager. Psychologically, a teenager can make conscious choice and apparently know what they are doing.
Proof? The age of consent in some European countries is 14.
See link below.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of ... ope#France
My friend from Vietnam told me, her parents were married at 13. Some part of the country, like in the mountain villages, people are still getting married at 15. Don’t believe me? Do your own research.
Ever wondered why the punishment for this type of crime in Cambodia is 1 - 3 yrs in prison and $2000 max in fine? Do your research.
The cultures are different around the globe.
Not supporting pedophiles or even for a second think that is ok; but I bring this up because I read a few comments who said it doesn’t matter what they did, who they are, regardless; just because of their age, no need to debate further because they are children. A 9yo or even 12yo are children. A teenager is not. Again, a teenager psychologically and even legally capable of making conscious choice. They can deliberately lie, commit crime and some are just as bad as “the adults”. Don’t believe it? 5 years ago, there was a murder of a whole family of 5 done by a 14 yo boy. I can share link; but I’m sure some of you have come across something like that, so do your own research if needed.
So to answer those who ask for leaving these girls out of question because they are “children”, let me ask you this, does it mean you would tolerate any crime a person made as long as he/she is under 18? Including murder? Including wrongly accuse of someone? No.
Age is not an indicator of maturity, nor characteristics. A 15 years old can lie. A 15 years old can commit crime. We are more likely to forgive them; and they are more likely to receive a lighter punishment. But that does not mean we disregard all evidence and blindly trust whatever they say. That means we still need to consider the evidence placed in front of us and put it in a fair perspective.
So move on to the next question, why do I doubt these girl.
First of all, the characteristics and the honesty of these girls are questionable. Besides all of points I mentioned in my other posts about them wandering alone at night; according to their own claims, this has happened 3 times. One of the girls actually introduced her cousin to the guy. If what they said is true, what does it sound like? It sounds like a young pimp in the making. Someone who can do that is apparently not a good girl, leave alone being innocent.
Second is the motive. According to these girls, he has had sex with them multiple times including one time in his trip in 2018. So why this only now came to the surface right about the time he was about to leave the country?
Third, for those who wonder, I happen to know more insider details because I am part of a Facebook music group that involve people who know him. No one for a second believes that he had done this. His family is desperately working to have him tried in the US. If he has committed this crime, why would they rather it be like that - knowing the punishment is way more severe over here. They want justice and a fair verdict.
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Oh, may I ask for your mailing address to mail you a copy of my birth certificate? Lmao. Oh but wait, can you read Khmer?Lucky Lucan wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 9:05 amThe fact that you are obviously lying about your identity is very relevant.Lonelyplanet wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:36 am
Lol. How is this related to the topic of discussion? You appear like a bitter loser, debating on an irrelevant fact instead of getting some valid points across. Be an educated adult.
Your question showed me that you don’t know much about the case but already jump on the wagon of the accuser. And barely can get back with a valid argument. But what can I expect from you...? You quickly assumed I was lying about my identity without even know me! Again, sorry, but still think you’re a bitter loser.
I can be proud that I know about Cambodia and SoutheastAsians more than most people here. Wanna talk Seagames? Wait, do you even know what Seagames is?
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Fucking idiotJackal wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 10:06 amFucking Rock lobster.Lonelyplanet wrote: ↑Tue Jun 04, 2019 9:59 amFor those who accused me for not showing enough sympathy for these girls, let me explain why. If I feel that they are truly an innocent honest victim, I’d 100% support them. But I don’t even feel like they are even trust-worthy, leave alone being an innocent victim.
First of all, let’s discuss a bit about age of consent. Let me remind you, these girls are NOT children. They are teenagers. Who have been a parents will know the difference of a child and a teenager. Psychologically, a teenager can make conscious choice and apparently know what they are doing.
Proof? The age of consent in some European countries is 14.
See link below.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ages_of ... ope#France
My friend from Vietnam told me, her parents were married at 13. Some part of the country, like in the mountain villages, people are still getting married at 15. Don’t believe me? Do your own research.
Ever wondered why the punishment for this type of crime in Cambodia is 1 - 3 yrs in prison and $2000 max in fine? Do your research.
The cultures are different around the globe.
Not supporting pedophiles or even for a second think that is ok; but I bring this up because I read a few comments who said it doesn’t matter what they did, who they are, regardless; just because of their age, no need to debate further because they are children. A 9yo or even 12yo are children. A teenager is not. Again, a teenager psychologically and even legally capable of making conscious choice. They can deliberately lie, commit crime and some are just as bad as “the adults”. Don’t believe it? 5 years ago, there was a murder of a whole family of 5 done by a 14 yo boy. I can share link; but I’m sure some of you have come across something like that, so do your own research if needed.
So to answer those who ask for leaving these girls out of question because they are “children”, let me ask you this, does it mean you would tolerate any crime a person made as long as he/she is under 18? Including murder? Including wrongly accuse of someone? No.
Age is not an indicator of maturity, nor characteristics. A 15 years old can lie. A 15 years old can commit crime. We are more likely to forgive them; and they are more likely to receive a lighter punishment. But that does not mean we disregard all evidence and blindly trust whatever they say. That means we still need to consider the evidence placed in front of us and put it in a fair perspective.
So move on to the next question, why do I doubt these girl.
First of all, the characteristics and the honesty of these girls are questionable. Besides all of points I mentioned in my other posts about them wandering alone at night; according to their own claims, this has happened 3 times. One of the girls actually introduced her cousin to the guy. If what they said is true, what does it sound like? It sounds like a young pimp in the making. Someone who can do that is apparently not a good girl, leave alone being innocent.
Second is the motive. According to these girls, he has had sex with them multiple times including one time in his trip in 2018. So why this only now came to the surface right about the time he was about to leave the country?
Third, for those who wonder, I happen to know more insider details because I am part of a Facebook music group that involve people who know him. No one for a second believes that he had done this. His family is desperately working to have him tried in the US. If he has committed this crime, why would they rather it be like that - knowing the punishment is way more severe over here. They want justice and a fair verdict.
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