Can a foreign-Khmer relationship ever be truly consensual?

[seidier]

Is it possible for a Cambodian and an expat to meet under neutral circumstances, take a liking to each other and pursue a relationship based on mutual affection? Aside from the absolute elite, there is usually a chasm of difference between the wealth and educational attainment of the average Cambodian and even the sleaziest, drug-addled sexpat. In addition, it's been my perception that Cambodian girls are usually raised to be servants with an internalized sense of inferiority to men. It makes me wonder if the Western, middle-class conception of marriage as an equal partnership between two people could ever be attained here. Thoughts? Or anecdotes that would suggest otherwise?

[proyat]

I was going to say "Jesus here we go...." But instead I'll go for guess you'll just have to try it and find out.

[the_purple_turtle]

It makes me wonder if the Western, middle-class conception of marriage as an equal partnership between two people could ever be attained here.

I think that it's not the default mode or way of thinking for a Khmer woman entering a relationship, but certainly achievable. Why wouldn't it be?

Is it possible for a Cambodian and an expat to meet under neutral circumstances, take a liking to each other and pursue a relationship based on mutual affection?

Get out of the bars and the answer is a big fat YES.

[franzjaeger]

as for me this fits the typical profile of a nun, i.e. problems with father or step father in childhood, developing of male hate, might be virgin, never married, divorced by circumstances of misunderstood love etc etc. also could be older, unattractive.. reclusive, and now featuring the course of liberation of all mankind, including herself, all here in cambodia,..(with a bit if stash to burn) starting with all the poor attractive girls coming to the riverside to seek a better life.. some of them even enjoying the thrillride of a 'redlight' existence, and can even drive a moto.., perhaps a flyer to deal around ?

[vladimir]

Is it possible for a Cambodian and an expat to meet under neutral circumstances, take a liking to each other and pursue a relationship based on mutual affection? Aside from the absolute elite, there is usually a chasm of difference between the wealth and educational attainment of the average Cambodian and even the sleaziest, drug-addled sexpat. In addition, it's been my perception that Cambodian girls are usually raised to be servants with an internalized sense of inferiority to men. It makes me wonder if the Western, middle-class conception of marriage as an equal partnership between two people could ever be attained here. Thoughts? Or anecdotes that would suggest otherwise?

Forgive me if I'm mistaken (that never happens) but you sound a little like a Marxist lady I once met, I think her name was Srey Lenin...

[andyinasia]

100% yes. You need to meet the right girl in the right environment and be the right kind of guy; same as anywhere.

[johnny99]

SL and whoever Seider is their threads generate a lot of posts but the TROLL FACTOR is running very high

johnny

Don't feed the trolls!!!

[robboat]

Is it possible for a Cambodian and an expat to meet under neutral circumstances, take a liking to each other and pursue a relationship based on mutual affection? Aside from the absolute elite, there is usually a chasm of difference between the wealth and educational attainment of the average Cambodian and even the sleaziest, drug-addled sexpat. In addition, it's been my perception that Cambodian girls are usually raised to be servants with an internalized sense of inferiority to men. It makes me wonder if the Western, middle-class conception of marriage as an equal partnership between two people could ever be attained here. Thoughts? Or anecdotes that would suggest otherwise?

1 - Yes.....mutual affection and love is common in relationships.
2 - This is not the Western world...it is the Eastern world....the priorities are very different.

Even in the West there it is often very difficult to get "equality" in marriage...after all you have to give more than you take to make a real relationship grow.
Given your perceptions - you need to take a good hard look at yourself and learn much more about Cambodian culture.
Learn and grow...try to leave the stereotypical thoughts behind.
Open heart, open mind.....

No trolling......

[TJP777]

as for me this fits the typical profile of a nun, i.e. problems with father or step father in childhood, developing of male hate, might be virgin, never married, divorced by circumstances of misunderstood love etc etc. also could be older, unattractive.. reclusive, and now featuring the course of liberation of all mankind, including herself, all here in cambodia,..(with a bit if stash to burn) starting with all the poor attractive girls coming to the riverside to seek a better life.. some of them even enjoying the thrillride of a 'redlight' existence, and can even drive a moto.., perhaps a flyer to deal around ?

You forgot to include "Shortish Haircut".

[andyinasia]

The OP wasn't trolling when she signed up; she was having a bad hair day:

http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=22025&p=264127#p264127

OP - are you acquainting yourself with the wrong kind of men? Jealous of happy mixed couples? C'mon, what the thinking behind your post?

[Lucky Lucan]

In addition, it's been my perception that Cambodian girls are usually raised to be servants with an internalized sense of inferiority to men.

I don't see it that way at all. You seem to have swallowed the western stereotype of Asian women without ever actually knowing any and you obviously haven't spent any time in a Cambodian household.

[Falcon Randwick]

Forgive me if I'm mistaken (that never happens) but you sound a little like a Marxist lady I once met, I think her name was Srey Lenin...

I pinged that from the get-go, Vlad. And by that I mean I didn't even have to read the post, as soon as I saw a new poster with that thread title I guessed 'Srey Lenin'. If I'm right, SL, dontcha think your schtick is shit?

[andyinasia]

Pretty sure it's not Srey Lenin. Can see where you're coming from tho'.

[tsuyoshi]

Women everywhere, not just in poor countries like Cambodia, try to "marry up". Being better educated and making more money (not to mention being taller, having lighter skin, etc.) will make you more popular with the ladies even in the wealthiest places in the world. The concept in play here is not "consent" but "arbitrage" -- there is an undersupply of middle-class fair-skinned men in Cambodia, relative to demand.

I believe that it is much more common for a Khmer-Khmer marriage to be nonconsensual, arranged by their parents. Often one of these arranged marriages are to a Khmer with foreign citizenship, but I don't think that's what you are asking about.

And, speaking as a man married to a Cambodian woman, women here are really not nearly as obedient as I might wish. I mean, sure, my wife will cook me meals and clean the house every day, but getting her to do anything that Cambodian women don't normally do (e.g. driving on the correct side of the street, throwing litter into a garbage can rather than onto the street, or performing oral sex), just because I want her to do it, is not easy. She is very happy to be married to me, but her world does not revolve around me.

[TJP777]

Is it possible for a Cambodian and an expat to meet under neutral circumstances, take a liking to each other and pursue a relationship based on mutual affection? Aside from the absolute elite, there is usually a chasm of difference between the wealth and educational attainment of the average Cambodian and even the sleaziest, drug-addled sexpat. In addition, it's been my perception that Cambodian girls are usually raised to be servants with an internalized sense of inferiority to men. It makes me wonder if the Western, middle-class conception of marriage as an equal partnership between two people could ever be attained here. Thoughts? Or anecdotes that would suggest otherwise?

I find it interesting that you use the word "consensual" in your subject line and then describe a scenario in your post text that has little or nothing to do with consent. Especially considering the "loaded" meaning that the word consent has in western gender politics. To spell it out for you - consensual is usually used in the context of sexual relationships and the absence of consent suggests rape.

On the question of consent in relationships I think the only relevant question is if both people are freely giving "informed consent". Of course external observers may judge a relationship to be one that they would not give "informed consent" to if they were the person in the relationship. Though the judgement of an external observe is really of no consequence when we talk about intimate relationships.

If what you really want to discuss is gender power imbalances I don't really think that it is fair to discuss foreign-khmer relationships in isolation with out looking at it in a global context.

I also find it interesting that the you mention "Foreign-Khmer relationship" in your subject line but in the post text you only describe relationships between western males and Khmer females. I for one know several Khmer male - Western female relationships as well as Khmers in relationship with Thais, Viets etc.