by claptrap1 » Tue Jan 31, 2017 3:03 am
My god, What was I doing reading the rant of this Denchao guy? He is obviously insecure as hell with a bee in his bonnet - being that uptight about who is and who is not a teacher is not "normal": I know a couple of people who are very intelligent (one is a genius) and have Asperger's syndrome: this Denchao guy sounds very much like them.
"I won't look down or crap on people with a CELTA. They do their thang and I do mine. But don't diss people who have gone through the QTS mill."
Nobody did, it was your perception. What was said that the skills you learn doing QTS are designed for monolingual school in a western country and don't always apply well in EFL situation, especially where the culture is as different as it is in Asia. You are right in that CELTA is simply an initial training to give some pointers and confidence for someone new to teaching: it is simply an indication that a person has some idea what they are doing and are "safe" to let loose in a classroom where the real, practical learning starts - just like a driving licence. On the other hand, if someone says they have DELTA, I would say that person IS qualified, as it is considered the same level of education as QTS/PGCE. But I don't think you understand / know the difference, even when the person in the thread tried to explain to you.
"It takes skills, man. Come in my classroom and then try to teach literacy, numeracy, art, science, geography, history, art, PE and more to a bunch of hyperactive 8 years old. You can't do that unless you had a hell of a training under your belt."
I have my utmost respect for those who have got a proper teacher's qualification but I think your statement of not being able to do it unless you have had "a hell of a training under your belt" shows deep ignorance of the situation in Cambodia. I have CELTA and another TEFL qualification equal to that but I don't think myself as qualified. As CELTA is designed exclusively for adults and teenagers, it is also pretty irrelevant for teaching kids as it is: in other words, most of us have had no guidance and get no support, which means that in some respect we efl teachers have even more difficult job in teaching hyperactive kids who are given books that are way beyond their comprehension of the language they contain, usually including at least one SEN kid thrown in - just like so many other teflers - and without the resources and support from psychologists, speech therapists, doctors etc that teachers in western countries have. The physical resources can be also non-existent in comparison unless you work in the most expensive international schools. In cheaper institutions the parents are often also ignorant about their child's issues or child development in general and many also but leave their child with relatives that don't care or cannot cope. Yet it is exactly those parents who never turn up to parents meetings and show no interest in their child otherwise are the ones most likely to complain that their 3-year old who has been to school already 6 months doesn't know the alphabet - kids who are hardly spoken to at home so their Khmer vocabulary and general comprehension would raise concern if they were raised in the west!
The other point I would like to point out is that the definition of a teacher is "someone whose job is to teach in a school or college" (Cambridge dictionary) or "some who teaches (especially in a school) - note that the word qualification or degree is not mentioned... So, so much for demanding efl teachers dropping the word "teacher" from their title! Sorry to burst your bubble... By the way, in my opinion, in some ways that disdain for teachers is nothing to do with teflers but because of Pol Pot: after the war was over, schools had to be filled with semi-literate, half-educated teachers. Don't know if education was respected before but I feel that there is still disdain and mistrust of educated people, possibly a hangover from Pol Pot times. Today the only thing that people respect is money and power.
If you like, you can call yourself a "registered teacher" if you want to distinguish yourself from lay teachers like me. I had to do the same when I was doing massage gigs*, to differentiate myself from the prostitutes and hobbyists /unqualified alternative therapists. But of course the uninitiated could never appreciate the hard work and over 600 hours of practical training with two weeks of observations from external bodies during the exam period. And why should they? It is enough for them to be able to trust that I know what I am doing and why - just like your employer and parents/students should be able to trust that you know what you're doing in the classroom. There's no need to make a song and dance about it at every possible opportunity. (The proper title in my country is "Trained Masseuse": only those with that title can be registered in the same database as qualified nurses and are bound by oath of patient confidentiality - but I used "registered" simply because it is more descriptive.)
That's enough of rant from me to this ancient and very silly thread. I hope Dengchao has woken up to the reality and mellowed a bit.
My god, What was I doing reading the rant of this Denchao guy? He is obviously insecure as hell with a bee in his bonnet - being that uptight about who is and who is not a teacher is not "normal": I know a couple of people who are very intelligent (one is a genius) and have Asperger's syndrome: this Denchao guy sounds very much like them.
"I won't look down or crap on people with a CELTA. They do their thang and I do mine. But don't diss people who have gone through the QTS mill."
Nobody did, it was your perception. What was said that the skills you learn doing QTS are designed for monolingual school in a western country and don't always apply well in EFL situation, especially where the culture is as different as it is in Asia. You are right in that CELTA is simply an initial training to give some pointers and confidence for someone new to teaching: it is simply an indication that a person has some idea what they are doing and are "safe" to let loose in a classroom where the real, practical learning starts - just like a driving licence. On the other hand, if someone says they have DELTA, I would say that person IS qualified, as it is considered the same level of education as QTS/PGCE. But I don't think you understand / know the difference, even when the person in the thread tried to explain to you.
"It takes skills, man. Come in my classroom and then try to teach literacy, numeracy, art, science, geography, history, art, PE and more to a bunch of hyperactive 8 years old. You can't do that unless you had a hell of a training under your belt."
I have my utmost respect for those who have got a proper teacher's qualification but I think your statement of not being able to do it unless you have had "a hell of a training under your belt" shows deep ignorance of the situation in Cambodia. I have CELTA and another TEFL qualification equal to that but I don't think myself as qualified. As CELTA is designed exclusively for adults and teenagers, it is also pretty irrelevant for teaching kids as it is: in other words, most of us have had no guidance and get no support, which means that in some respect we efl teachers have even more difficult job in teaching hyperactive kids who are given books that are way beyond their comprehension of the language they contain, usually including at least one SEN kid thrown in - just like so many other teflers - and without the resources and support from psychologists, speech therapists, doctors etc that teachers in western countries have. The physical resources can be also non-existent in comparison unless you work in the most expensive international schools. In cheaper institutions the parents are often also ignorant about their child's issues or child development in general and many also but leave their child with relatives that don't care or cannot cope. Yet it is exactly those parents who never turn up to parents meetings and show no interest in their child otherwise are the ones most likely to complain that their 3-year old who has been to school already 6 months doesn't know the alphabet - kids who are hardly spoken to at home so their Khmer vocabulary and general comprehension would raise concern if they were raised in the west!
The other point I would like to point out is that the definition of a teacher is "someone whose job is to teach in a school or college" (Cambridge dictionary) or "some who teaches (especially in a school) - note that the word qualification or degree is not mentioned... So, so much for demanding efl teachers dropping the word "teacher" from their title! Sorry to burst your bubble... By the way, [i]in my opinion[/i], in some ways that disdain for teachers is nothing to do with teflers but because of Pol Pot: after the war was over, schools had to be filled with semi-literate, half-educated teachers. Don't know if education was respected before but I feel that there is still disdain and mistrust of educated people, possibly a hangover from Pol Pot times. Today the only thing that people respect is money and power.
If you like, you can call yourself a "registered teacher" if you want to distinguish yourself from lay teachers like me. I had to do the same when I was doing massage gigs*, to differentiate myself from the prostitutes and hobbyists /unqualified alternative therapists. But of course the uninitiated could never appreciate the hard work and over 600 hours of practical training with two weeks of observations from external bodies during the exam period. And why should they? It is enough for them to be able to trust that I know what I am doing and why - just like your employer and parents/students should be able to trust that you know what you're doing in the classroom. There's no need to make a song and dance about it at every possible opportunity. (The proper title in my country is "Trained Masseuse": only those with that title can be registered in the same database as qualified nurses and are bound by oath of patient confidentiality - but I used "registered" simply because it is more descriptive.)
That's enough of rant from me to this ancient and very silly thread. I hope Dengchao has woken up to the reality and mellowed a bit.