Here isa novel idea: actually read the thread before commentingMetal1982 wrote:Pics look staged to me. They look posed. Typically a suicide scene won't have the faces pointing that we'll to the camera and room. Also the feet are just on the floor. In a suicide they are going to go over a rafter or a high beam to make sure the deed is done.
Apparent double suicide of British man and woman, Rob Wells and Imogen Goldie-Wells, in Sihanoukville
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While certainly tragic, it seems a bit reckless and premature to be using this case as some sort of indictment of the Tories or the NHS. Nobody here knows what level of care the victims did or didn't have. The NHS is generally ranked as one of the best healthcare systems in the world.
Harold wrote:While certainly tragic, it seems a bit reckless and premature to be using this case as some sort of indictment of the Tories or the NHS. Nobody here knows what level of care the victims did or didn't have. The NHS is generally ranked as one of the best healthcare systems in the world.
Reckless and premature?
Their suicide note highlighted that they had not received the care they had needed.
And;
"...demand for mental health services has risen by a staggering 20 per cent over the last five years - while mental health service budgets were cut by 8 per cent in real terms."
And
"Experts from the Universities of Liverpool and Oxford recently found that the introduction of Iain Duncan Smith’s tougher fit-to-work tests for sick and disabled people have coincided with 590 “additional” suicides, 279,000 cases of mental illness and 725,000 more prescriptions for antidepressants – and research from 1,000 GPs undertaken by mental health charity ReThink found that a staggering 21 per cent of their patients had experienced suicidal ideation due to the stress of the Work Capability Assessments."
And
"recent cuts to support services have left an estimated 10,000 victims of sexual abuse waiting over a year for access to counselling services."
And
"Mental health services currently receive just 13 per cent of NHS funding, despite accounting for more than a fifth (23 per cent) of the disease burden in the UK. Over £11billion worth of funding would be required to bridge this gap."
Reckless and premature? Or informed and factual and pointing a finger at something that has, at the very least, been a contributing factor to this tragedy?
“The whole secret lies in confusing the enemy, so that he cannot fathom our real intent.”
There are many people who receive outstanding treatment and still complain about their quality of care. It is impossible to please everyone.Their suicide note highlighted that they had not received the care they had needed.
Do you know their medical history? Can you tell me at what point the NHS let them down?
Edit: I get your point though. Thanks for posting those statistics.
Harold wrote:There are many people who receive outstanding treatment and still complain about their quality of care. It is impossible to please everyone.Their suicide note highlighted that they had not received the care they had needed.
Do you know their medical history? Can you tell me at what point the NHS let them down?
You are sort of missing the point. The note specifically said that they felt the NHS had let them down.
The reality of that, as I evidenced, is that the Tories have decimated MH services in England and Wales. Suicide rates are up. Prescriptions for anti-depressants are up. Suicidal ideation is up. Yet spending, services, and MH beds are drastically down and still being reduced.
“The whole secret lies in confusing the enemy, so that he cannot fathom our real intent.”
Mountains of literature on the demise of the NHS
The NHS has been legally abolished. Perhaps most controversial is the opening up of NHS contracts to unlimited privatisation. Last year alone, out of £9.63bn worth of NHS deals signed, £3.54bn (nearly 40% of them) went to private firms. Private providers are cherry-picking lucrative services to boost their profits leaving the NHS with less money to provide comprehensive care. This neatly ties in with the next aspect of the legislation.
The Health Act also severs the government’s responsibility for the NHS devolving it to a series of bodies. The Manchester experiment is the next phase. Devolving health and social care spending to regional control is actually the dismantling of a national health service under the guise of localism. There is nothing to stop the CCGs breaking away completely. Commissioning support units (CSU) are to be spun off and privatised. The likes of UnitedHealth and Serco will be in the running to take over these crucially important bodies.
https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare- ... vatisation
The NHS has been legally abolished. Perhaps most controversial is the opening up of NHS contracts to unlimited privatisation. Last year alone, out of £9.63bn worth of NHS deals signed, £3.54bn (nearly 40% of them) went to private firms. Private providers are cherry-picking lucrative services to boost their profits leaving the NHS with less money to provide comprehensive care. This neatly ties in with the next aspect of the legislation.
The Health Act also severs the government’s responsibility for the NHS devolving it to a series of bodies. The Manchester experiment is the next phase. Devolving health and social care spending to regional control is actually the dismantling of a national health service under the guise of localism. There is nothing to stop the CCGs breaking away completely. Commissioning support units (CSU) are to be spun off and privatised. The likes of UnitedHealth and Serco will be in the running to take over these crucially important bodies.
https://www.theguardian.com/healthcare- ... vatisation
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The NHS has been deeply in the red for a couple of decades. Something has to change, including people's attitude of entitlement
The mind is not a vessel to be filled, but a fire to be kindled.
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Yeah, and what's up with blaming the NHS for something that happened in Cambodia? Are the NHS supposed to open clinics all around the world or something?violet wrote: Something has to change, including people's attitude of entitlement
Romantic Cambodia is dead and gone. It's with McKinley in the grave.
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While it's great to politicise these suicides, how about tempering it with some facts.
1. NHS net expenditure (resource plus capital, minus depreciation) has increased from £75.822 billion in 2005/06 to £117.229 billion in 2015/16. Planned expenditure for 2016/17 is £120.611bn.
2. In real terms the budget is expected to increase from £117.229bn in 2015/16 to £120.151bn by 2019/20.
3. Health expenditure (medical services, health research, central and other health services) per capita in England has risen from £1,868 in 2010/11 to £2,057 in 2014/15.
4. The NHS net deficit for the 2015/16 financial year was £1.851 billion (£599m underspend by commissioners and a £2.45bn deficit for trusts and foundation trusts).
5. The most recently published national surveys of investment for mental health found there had been real terms reductions of 1 per cent for working age adults and 3.1 per cent for older people in 2011/12.
Also, the UK's suicide rates compare pretty well to other industrialised nations and don't look out of the ordinary. There has been an uptick in male suicide rates for sure, but they have decreased for women.
Meanwhile, the girl's mother has raised over £4000 to travel to Cambodia to cremate her daughter and take her ashes back to the UK.
http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/help-me-sa ... o-my-baby/
1. NHS net expenditure (resource plus capital, minus depreciation) has increased from £75.822 billion in 2005/06 to £117.229 billion in 2015/16. Planned expenditure for 2016/17 is £120.611bn.
2. In real terms the budget is expected to increase from £117.229bn in 2015/16 to £120.151bn by 2019/20.
3. Health expenditure (medical services, health research, central and other health services) per capita in England has risen from £1,868 in 2010/11 to £2,057 in 2014/15.
4. The NHS net deficit for the 2015/16 financial year was £1.851 billion (£599m underspend by commissioners and a £2.45bn deficit for trusts and foundation trusts).
5. The most recently published national surveys of investment for mental health found there had been real terms reductions of 1 per cent for working age adults and 3.1 per cent for older people in 2011/12.
Also, the UK's suicide rates compare pretty well to other industrialised nations and don't look out of the ordinary. There has been an uptick in male suicide rates for sure, but they have decreased for women.
Meanwhile, the girl's mother has raised over £4000 to travel to Cambodia to cremate her daughter and take her ashes back to the UK.
http://www.crowdfunder.co.uk/help-me-sa ... o-my-baby/
Alan, some sources for those figures?
Last edited by Stramash on Tue Jan 03, 2017 5:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.
“The whole secret lies in confusing the enemy, so that he cannot fathom our real intent.”
That is the very selfish part in their choice of departure.Meanwhile, the girl's mother has raised over £4000 to travel to Cambodia to cremate her daughter and take her ashes back to the UK.
But all druggies are selfish gits, IMO.
The only folks i feel sorry for is the families.
I hope they can soon rest in peace.
Blaming the health service is a cop out, IMO.
They were NEVER EVER going to be treated for their problems in Cambodia.
My Three Mothers Tell Me I'm An Attention Whore.. I Love My Mums
I agree 100% behind you.bigphatt wrote:That is the very selfish part in their choice of departure.Meanwhile, the girl's mother has raised over £4000 to travel to Cambodia to cremate her daughter and take her ashes back to the UK.
But all druggies are selfish gits, IMO.
The only folks i feel sorry for is the families.
I hope they can soon rest in peace.
Blaming the health service is a cop out, IMO.
They were NEVER EVER going to be treated for their problems in Cambodia.
I refuse to go out with nothing more than a whimper followed by a small farting sound and a shit stain on my bed sheets..
Just thought I'd share that with you.
Just thought I'd share that with you.
scoffer wrote:I agree 100% behind you.
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