American Mark Alan Vandewater (from Florida!) arrested for extortion
$10,000 mth! I'd be a bar girl for that
Couldn't really understand the whole story, OP might want to break it down a bit more clearly, and use paragraphs, and no, I'm not an English teacher
I'm not a negative person, I encourage people all the time...it's usually to f**k off! But, whatever.
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Let me to explain something to you. You're getting way too hung up on whether or not Vandewater demanded money.JohnSmith wrote:Vandewater was offered images from the bars cctv to pressure Martin into cutting all ties with the bar. This is exactly what he did, with an anonymous letter, telling him to cut all ties with Lyna, or he would inform the wife, and also his company, DFDL.
If the two sentences that you typed above are true, then Vandewater committed blackmail. If you tell someone "Do this for me or I will send your wife photos of you with a hooker," that's blackmail. It doesn't matter if he also demanded money.
Look at the Penal Code of Cambodia's definition of the crime of blackmail.
Subsection 2 of Article 372 says you commit blackmail if you obtain a "commitment or renunciation" "by means of threatening to disclose or to impute facts so as knowingly to ruin a person's honour or friendship."
That's what Vandewater did, according to you. He demanded a commitment from Desautels to cut all ties with Lyna or else he would disclose embarrassing facts to Desautels' wife and co-workers.
Blackmail, and attempted blackmail, are punishable by 2-5 years in prison. In addition, Article 374 says that if the blackmailer goes through with the disclosure and carries out the threat, then the penalty is 5-10 years in prison.
It seems to me that Vandewater attempted to blackmail Desautels, Desautels resisted that, and Vandewater is now carrying out the threat by disseminating the embarrassing CCTV photos and facts to his friends so that they may be spread online to harm Desautels.
You posts aren't helping Vandewater. You're establishing his guilt and his liability for a greatly enhanced sentence.
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From the name on that imgur account, it looks like the guy accusing Martin Desautels of fabricating criminal charges against Mark Vandewater is the same guy who accused Frenchman Yves Corre of rape back in April:Marmite wrote:If you are going to get involved in a pending criminal case, you might want to think twice about creating an imgur account using your real name. That's a classic dumb fuck move.
http://www.khmer440.com/chat_forum/view ... es#p870897
Last edited by gavinmac on Fri Aug 25, 2017 7:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Last night I received an email from DFDL containing the following:
Upon receipt I contacted DFDL to ask if they intended me to publish it so that posters would be aware their posts could form part of a criminal investigation. I received a reply from the firm's CEO to say he would "come back to me more fully on my emails".
I asked the question because it seemed to me them sending that to me alone was pointless, yet at the same time the covering email was marked Private And Confidential and I didnt want to break their confidence. I decided to wait until this morning UK time for their response. I received no response this morning, so I emailed their CEO again with the same question. Again no response.
However, thirty minutes ago I received another letter from their solicitors, a Mr Tann Meng Sroy and Sithisak Law Office. In it, Mr Tann wrote the following:
"The purpose of our Legal Notice dated 24 August 2017 (the "Notice") was to inform you that the information reported in the Khmer440 internet forum in relation to the Complaint constitute aggravating circumstances to a criminal offence. Anyone or any media facilitating the dissemination of that information is subject of a criminal investigation.
"Some of the posters in the Forum have clearly understood that releasing this information could trigger legal consequences. However, we note that you / Khmer440 have taken no steps to inform posters of that and therefore urge you to remove the discussion thread referred to above on that basis. At this point, registered users would understand that the contents of that discussion is clearly inflammatory and can be removed since it is subject to a criminal investigation. If this is not resolved, our Client will consider all legal aspects in order to file a complaint against the relevant persons including against yourself and Khmer440 as part of the existing proceedings for facilitating the commission of a criminal offense."
I have stayed out of this thread on purpose. My connection with DFDL is wellknown, and I happen to like the plaintiff in this case.
JohnSmith is on dodgy ground here, making some pretty outrageous accusations. Proving that someone spent some time in a bar with a girl and that some other guy sent money to a girl does not prove what he is alleging here.
Upon receipt I contacted DFDL to ask if they intended me to publish it so that posters would be aware their posts could form part of a criminal investigation. I received a reply from the firm's CEO to say he would "come back to me more fully on my emails".
I asked the question because it seemed to me them sending that to me alone was pointless, yet at the same time the covering email was marked Private And Confidential and I didnt want to break their confidence. I decided to wait until this morning UK time for their response. I received no response this morning, so I emailed their CEO again with the same question. Again no response.
However, thirty minutes ago I received another letter from their solicitors, a Mr Tann Meng Sroy and Sithisak Law Office. In it, Mr Tann wrote the following:
"The purpose of our Legal Notice dated 24 August 2017 (the "Notice") was to inform you that the information reported in the Khmer440 internet forum in relation to the Complaint constitute aggravating circumstances to a criminal offence. Anyone or any media facilitating the dissemination of that information is subject of a criminal investigation.
"Some of the posters in the Forum have clearly understood that releasing this information could trigger legal consequences. However, we note that you / Khmer440 have taken no steps to inform posters of that and therefore urge you to remove the discussion thread referred to above on that basis. At this point, registered users would understand that the contents of that discussion is clearly inflammatory and can be removed since it is subject to a criminal investigation. If this is not resolved, our Client will consider all legal aspects in order to file a complaint against the relevant persons including against yourself and Khmer440 as part of the existing proceedings for facilitating the commission of a criminal offense."
I have stayed out of this thread on purpose. My connection with DFDL is wellknown, and I happen to like the plaintiff in this case.
JohnSmith is on dodgy ground here, making some pretty outrageous accusations. Proving that someone spent some time in a bar with a girl and that some other guy sent money to a girl does not prove what he is alleging here.
What exactly are the criminal allegations made against what is posted in this thread? I thought the current case is civil, and I also think defamation is a civil matter.
I would like to politely inform those who threaten 440 with legal action about the Streisand effect. Trying to censor information online backfires every time. The cat is out of the bag. It was posted on Cambodia Expats Online and it was not until weeks later that it has now been published here. Prior to that it was a topic of bar conversation.
I sincerely have no intention of disrupting an ongoing court case, nor do I believe I have said anything about it. I am not a lawyer, but I don't believe that filing court cases against the owners of 440 or those who post here will have the intended effect. The cat is out of the bag, so to speak. It is unfortunate, and I suppose it is part of the blackmailing which the case is about.
My point is that trying to censor information already made public, albeit under highly questionable circumstances, will not help to dampen the attention this case has already received.
I sincerely hope that those involved find justice, but I do not believe that carrying out the actions quoted by scobienz will have the intended result. 440 does not have the power to prevent this from spreading. It has been indexed and cached by Google et al. I understand the intention, but frankly, and unfortunately, at this point it is not reversable, with or without the co-operation of 440 owners.
Bless
I would like to politely inform those who threaten 440 with legal action about the Streisand effect. Trying to censor information online backfires every time. The cat is out of the bag. It was posted on Cambodia Expats Online and it was not until weeks later that it has now been published here. Prior to that it was a topic of bar conversation.
I sincerely have no intention of disrupting an ongoing court case, nor do I believe I have said anything about it. I am not a lawyer, but I don't believe that filing court cases against the owners of 440 or those who post here will have the intended effect. The cat is out of the bag, so to speak. It is unfortunate, and I suppose it is part of the blackmailing which the case is about.
My point is that trying to censor information already made public, albeit under highly questionable circumstances, will not help to dampen the attention this case has already received.
I sincerely hope that those involved find justice, but I do not believe that carrying out the actions quoted by scobienz will have the intended result. 440 does not have the power to prevent this from spreading. It has been indexed and cached by Google et al. I understand the intention, but frankly, and unfortunately, at this point it is not reversable, with or without the co-operation of 440 owners.
Bless
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I may well be wrong but I though it was a criminal matter in the KOW.Alexandra wrote:I thought the current case is civil, and I also think defamation is a civil matter.
Law360, New York (August 6, 2014, 10:25 AM EDT) --
On July 24, 2014, a British expat living in Cambodia was convicted of defamation in the Phnom Penh Municipal Court for statements published on his personal blog relating to the director of a private investment firm. The case has implications for anyone doing business in the region and serves as an important reminder that, despite recent reforms, defamation remains a crime in certain pockets of Southeast Asia.
https://www.law360.com/articles/563564/ ... w-is-broad
Note to self: Must be nice to morons.
You're right, there was an argument about it around 2006 and later it seems it was moved to Criminal Code 2009.LaudJohn wrote:I may well be wrong but I though it was a criminal matter in the KOW.
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Have I got this wrong, or is this just two Frenchies arguing over the same hooker ??
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scobienz wrote:
JohnSmith is on dodgy ground here, making some pretty outrageous accusations. Proving that someone spent some time in a bar with a girl and that some other guy sent money to a girl does not prove what he is alleging here.
Yeah, his posts are full of unsubstantiated allegations about third parties who I don't ever want to know. I wasted a few minutes of my life watching those shitty security camera videos. I was on the edge of my seat expecting some action, but absolutely nothing happened. Fuck that, if you're going to snoop around it's gotta be more interesting than "guy hooks up with girl".
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I already tried to point that out to him but he seems to think that blackmail that doesn't involve money isn't really blackmail, it's just raffish, scallywag behaviour, all's fair in love and war stuff. That mug was white knighting those two whores, dumping tens of thousands of dollars on them and then getting royally fucked by them when they teamed up with the so-called enemy to stab him in the back. It was the only fucking he got, apparently, as according to Smith, that Wandewater mug didn't even get his dick wet even once.gavinmac wrote:Let me to explain something to you. You're getting way too hung up on whether or not Vandewater demanded money.JohnSmith wrote:Vandewater was offered images from the bars cctv to pressure Martin into cutting all ties with the bar. This is exactly what he did, with an anonymous letter, telling him to cut all ties with Lyna, or he would inform the wife, and also his company, DFDL.
If the two sentences that you typed above are true, then Vandewater committed blackmail. If you tell someone "Do this for me or I will send your wife photos of you with a hooker," that's blackmail. It doesn't matter if he also demanded money.
Look at the Penal Code of Cambodia's definition of the crime of blackmail.
Subsection 2 of Article 372 says you commit blackmail if you obtain a "commitment or renunciation" "by means of threatening to disclose or to impute facts so as knowingly to ruin a person's honour or friendship."
That's what Vandewater did, according to you. He demanded a commitment from Desautels to cut all ties with Lyna or else he would disclose embarrassing facts to Desautels' wife and co-workers.
Blackmail, and attempted blackmail, are punishable by 2-5 years in prison. In addition, Article 374 says that if the blackmailer goes through with the disclosure and carries out the threat, then the penalty is 5-10 years in prison.
It seems to me that Vandewater attempted to blackmail Desautels, Desautels resisted that, and Vandewater is now carrying out the threat by disseminating the embarrassing CCTV photos and facts to his friends so that they may be spread online to harm Desautels.
You posts aren't helping Vandewater. You're establishing his guilt and his liability for a greatly enhanced sentence.
Even if it was a civil matter, he is criminally stupid in his conduct towards the whores and the lawyer. As I alluded to above, fuck him, absolute assclown.
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Wait, how did the whores team up with the enemy to stab him in the back? He tried to extort the lawyer, the lawyer had him arrested. I don't see how the whores were involved with him being arrested or prosecuted.bipolar bear wrote:That mug was white knighting those two whores, dumping tens of thousands of dollars on them and then getting royally fucked by them when they teamed up with the so-called enemy to stab him in the back.
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gavinmac wrote:Wait, how did the whores team up with the enemy to stab him in the back? He tried to extort the lawyer, the lawyer had him arrested. I don't see how the whores were involved with him being arrested or prosecuted.bipolar bear wrote:That mug was white knighting those two whores, dumping tens of thousands of dollars on them and then getting royally fucked by them when they teamed up with the so-called enemy to stab him in the back.
He supposedly sent the letter to the lawyer anonymously. Somebody ratted him out and when you couple that with the highly plausible assertion, above, I'd say it was the whores and the lawyer in a pincer movement.Martin, realizing he did not have enough to go to the police, using the foundations that had already been laid by Vandewater, turned it into a criminal extortion case by switching the demand to a fee of 10000 USD, aided by Thida and Lyna who knew Vandewater's address, and would, among other things, not have to ever return the 30000 USD they had borrowed from him.
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