There is a particularly self-righteous article in SEA Globe about a report from NGO World Animal Protection suggesting that elephants in sanctuaries and parks across Asia, including Cambodia and Thailand, are treated cruelly. It is getting quite a lot of resistance on FB where westerners involved in these ventures are calling the NGO out as being sensationalist simply to justify their own existence.
I dunno. I don't have a huge amount of experience in this, but it always struck me that the people who work in these places seem to genuinely care about the animals and they seem well taken care of. I've not been to a place in Cambodia that has them; my experience was in a few parks in Thailand.
I must admit I hated seeing the baby elephants being dragged around the streets of Sukhumvit, but that was clearly different.
How are the animals treated in Cambodian equivalents?
The story:http://sea-globe.com/report-reveals-exp ... ross-asia/
Thousands of elephants being used in Southeast Asia’s tourist industries are being kept in “cruel” conditions when out of the public eye, according to a World Animal Protection report released on Thursday.
The report revealed that more than three quarters of almost 3,000 surveyed elephants across 220 popular Southeast Asian tourist destinations were being kept in severely inadequate settings and fed poor diets when not being used for entertainment purposes.
According to the animal rights NGO, 2,000 elephants throughout Laos, Nepal, Sri Lanka, Thailand, India and Cambodia between mid-2014 and late 2016 were subject to “severe” suffering, while 1,839 of them were kept on chains less than 3 metres long.
Are elephant sanctuaries cruel?
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Are elephant sanctuaries cruel?
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I think that you are completely confusing the issues here. You mention "sanctuaries", but nowhere in that article does it mention "sanctuaries" -- it mentions the tourist industry as a whole. Admittedly, I did not look at the actual report.
There are different industries and things that need to be looked at here. There are many many places throughout the region where you can ride elephants - this is generally regarded as a bad thing to do. As the article mentions, it requires a process known as "crushing" the elephants - much like "breaking" a horse, just substantially more cruel. In addition, the process of elephants kneeling down so tourists can climb aboard is very painful for them and detrimental to their health.
There are a lot of very good sanctuaries and "projects" in the region. One that comes to mind is the Banung Elephant Project. When you go with them you will see how much they do respect the elephants, and you certainly won't be allowed to ride them (you can feed them and bathe them, however). This is a small one in Mondulkiri, and certainly there are larger ones that other people can speak more about.
What you want to look out for are places that are clearly capitalizing on them, and that let you ride them. There is a wide spectrum of treatment, from the example of the elephant that died of exhaustion last year at Angkor Wat, to legit sanctuaries. Hopefully someone with better knowledge can clarify further here.
There are different industries and things that need to be looked at here. There are many many places throughout the region where you can ride elephants - this is generally regarded as a bad thing to do. As the article mentions, it requires a process known as "crushing" the elephants - much like "breaking" a horse, just substantially more cruel. In addition, the process of elephants kneeling down so tourists can climb aboard is very painful for them and detrimental to their health.
There are a lot of very good sanctuaries and "projects" in the region. One that comes to mind is the Banung Elephant Project. When you go with them you will see how much they do respect the elephants, and you certainly won't be allowed to ride them (you can feed them and bathe them, however). This is a small one in Mondulkiri, and certainly there are larger ones that other people can speak more about.
What you want to look out for are places that are clearly capitalizing on them, and that let you ride them. There is a wide spectrum of treatment, from the example of the elephant that died of exhaustion last year at Angkor Wat, to legit sanctuaries. Hopefully someone with better knowledge can clarify further here.
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Miguelito wrote:I think that you are completely confusing the issues here. You mention "sanctuaries", but nowhere in that article does it mention "sanctuaries" -- it mentions the tourist industry as a whole. Admittedly, I did not look at the actual report.
There are different industries and things that need to be looked at here. There are many many places throughout the region where you can ride elephants - this is generally regarded as a bad thing to do. As the article mentions, it requires a process known as "crushing" the elephants - much like "breaking" a horse, just substantially more cruel. In addition, the process of elephants kneeling down so tourists can climb aboard is very painful for them and detrimental to their health.
There are a lot of very good sanctuaries and "projects" in the region. One that comes to mind is the Banung Elephant Project. When you go with them you will see how much they do respect the elephants, and you certainly won't be allowed to ride them (you can feed them and bathe them, however). This is a small one in Mondulkiri, and certainly there are larger ones that other people can speak more about.
What you want to look out for are places that are clearly capitalizing on them, and that let you ride them. There is a wide spectrum of treatment, from the example of the elephant that died of exhaustion last year at Angkor Wat, to legit sanctuaries. Hopefully someone with better knowledge can clarify further here.
You're right. The article referred to the places where elephants do tricks like paint or play football, the argument being that to get them skilled like that they have to be taken from parents at an early age and trained for life.
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You should edit the title. Elephant sanctuaries are places where they take former working elephants for retirement. In the past elephants were used a lot as pack animals to move logs/ as taxis etc, but this has declined and many are used for tourist jaunts now, there are a lot around Angkor and in the North-east. Sambo who used to be around Wat Phnom and slept behind the Australian Embassy was "rescued" by some dubious organization a few years ago. Her feet were in bits, so it was good that they removed her from her daily trawl. However it turned out later she was being kept on a patch of wasteland out in Chum Chao and her mahout couldn't afford to feed her because they had withdrawn their support. Fortunately, the good folks at Elephant Valley Project managed to transport her up to Mondulkiri where she chills out in the forest and swims in the lake everyday.
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/me ... s/sambo-2/
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/me ... s/sambo-2/
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Yeah, its kind of like asking 'are hospices cruel'?Lucky Lucan wrote:You should edit the title. Elephant sanctuaries are places where they take former working elephants for retirement. In the past elephants were used a lot as pack animals to move logs/ as taxis etc, but this has declined and many are used for tourist jaunts now, there are a lot around Angkor and in the North-east. Sambo who used to be around Wat Phnom and slept behind the Australian Embassy was "rescued" by some dubious organization a few years ago. Her feet were in bits, so it was good that they removed her from her daily trawl. However it turned out later she was being kept on a patch of wasteland out in Chum Chao and her mahout couldn't afford to feed her because they had withdrawn their support. Fortunately, the good folks at Elephant Valley Project managed to transport her up to Mondulkiri where she chills out in the forest and swims in the lake everyday.
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/me ... s/sambo-2/
Quite a few years ago I went to a elephant show for tourists in N. Thailand. Admittedly, it was great fun at the time, but then afterwards I got thinking about how humane they were. I wouldn't go to another one.
Don't you mean inhumane?ផោមក្លិនស្អុយ wrote:Yeah, its kind of like asking 'are hospices cruel'?Lucky Lucan wrote:You should edit the title. Elephant sanctuaries are places where they take former working elephants for retirement. In the past elephants were used a lot as pack animals to move logs/ as taxis etc, but this has declined and many are used for tourist jaunts now, there are a lot around Angkor and in the North-east. Sambo who used to be around Wat Phnom and slept behind the Australian Embassy was "rescued" by some dubious organization a few years ago. Her feet were in bits, so it was good that they removed her from her daily trawl. However it turned out later she was being kept on a patch of wasteland out in Chum Chao and her mahout couldn't afford to feed her because they had withdrawn their support. Fortunately, the good folks at Elephant Valley Project managed to transport her up to Mondulkiri where she chills out in the forest and swims in the lake everyday.
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/me ... s/sambo-2/
Quite a few years ago I went to a elephant show for tourists in N. Thailand. Admittedly, it was great fun at the time, but then afterwards I got thinking about how humane they were. I wouldn't go to another one.
Either way animal shows have never interested me and I don't get why they are so popular. Look people, this animal is doing tricks!
SeaWorld is the worse. Bastards.
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No, I meant humane. Quit being contrary, if I said 'YTP isn't so clever' would you ask me if I meant to say 'YTP is stupid'?YaTingPom wrote:Don't you mean inhumane?ផោមក្លិនស្អុយ wrote:Yeah, its kind of like asking 'are hospices cruel'?Lucky Lucan wrote:You should edit the title. Elephant sanctuaries are places where they take former working elephants for retirement. In the past elephants were used a lot as pack animals to move logs/ as taxis etc, but this has declined and many are used for tourist jaunts now, there are a lot around Angkor and in the North-east. Sambo who used to be around Wat Phnom and slept behind the Australian Embassy was "rescued" by some dubious organization a few years ago. Her feet were in bits, so it was good that they removed her from her daily trawl. However it turned out later she was being kept on a patch of wasteland out in Chum Chao and her mahout couldn't afford to feed her because they had withdrawn their support. Fortunately, the good folks at Elephant Valley Project managed to transport her up to Mondulkiri where she chills out in the forest and swims in the lake everyday.
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/
http://www.elephantvalleyproject.org/me ... s/sambo-2/
Quite a few years ago I went to a elephant show for tourists in N. Thailand. Admittedly, it was great fun at the time, but then afterwards I got thinking about how humane they were. I wouldn't go to another one.
Either way animal shows have never interested me and I don't get why they are so popular. Look people, this animal is doing tricks!
SeaWorld is the worse. Bastards.
I wondered how humane they were. And decided that they probably weren't very humane. Or as you prefer, in other words, probably quite inhumane.
You'd love a show of a chimpanzee dinner party or dogs playing billiards or a giraffe changing a flat tyre. Come on man, experience life!
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I guess they will be extinct in the wild eventually anyway? At which point they will become a novelty item, and be treated more like cuddly pandas.
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how they break elephants is 100 % cruel
Elephant sanctuaries are not cruel, but very humane
not sure about Cambodia, but i have seen wild elephants more than a few times in national parks here in Thailand
Elephant sanctuaries are not cruel, but very humane
not sure about Cambodia, but i have seen wild elephants more than a few times in national parks here in Thailand
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