GaryH wrote:Lucky Lucan wrote:Abou-Gor wrote:
I presume it became the way it is, not by any internal Chinese initiative, but by western manufacturers seeing that they could turn a rather large profit by closing down their western production and outsourcing to China.
So you are basically saying that Chinese aren't smart enough to get their act together over the past 50 years themselves, and the initiative to develop China into the economic powerhouse it is today was led by western manufacturers? You sound extremely prejudiced and racist.
Yeah to say they are not smart enough is naive. They are sneaky and manipulative. You can not trust them to tell you the truth, even your good friends will lie to you here on a daily basis. It's completely socially acceptable. In fact when it comes to business it is the preferred way.
But none of this says they're not smart, or that their economy isn't they way it is because of their own doing. While the West was exploiting and abusing China's cheap labour, China was taking all that money and buying up all the debt, real estate and businesses they could get their hands on in these Western countries. That is not stupid
Another thing to note is whether the term "economic powerhouse" is even accurate. For the last few years China has been a place of constant development. The construction crews run literally 24 hours a day 7 days a week building stuff. Every where you look are cranes. This year that all stopped. I live in a massive city of 10 million people, all the construction has just stopped. Half finished abandoned projects every direction you look. All my rich Chinese have either sold all the businesses and property and moved to America, Australia, England, etc. Or if they haven't yet they are in the process of doing so. There was such a massive exit from the country with anyone that had money a few months back that the country put crazy restrictions on how much we are allowed to send home now. We can send no more than 50,000rmb a year home now, that's only about $10,000. My friends here have resorted to strapping cash to their body and going on holidays to get their money back home. It's fairly commonly accepted here that their "powerhouse" title won't last
Lucan and Gary - I live and work in China since a couple of years and I have a Chinese wife i met many years ago, so I think I can contribute a little. First, Lucan, the Chinese are smart enough to get their act together but after the gross mismanagement of their country that started with the Qing dynasty and ended with the Gang of Four, Deng XiaoPing decided that in order to catch up more quickly, Western companies would be invited to assist.
As the economy developed during the '80s and '90s, China became a favorite place to place certain manufacturing. China could not have done this by itself for it lacked the international brands needed to sell off the goods produced, it lacked the capital in those days and it lacked the know how how to make modern consumer products. At the same time, it must be remembered that China independently after the break with the Soviet Union was able to develop the thermonuclear bomb, so no-one can question their intellectual capability, but developing and producing modern consumer goods that can be sold with profit in a competitive market take more (marketing, brands, quality control, distribution) than China can currently handle.
Chinese brands like XiaoMi have recently begun making inroads in mature markets but more complicated products like cars are still very much only for the domestic market. They manufacture a lot of Western cars locally including for export but this is not without foreign assistance. Next step for China is obviously to export ore cars of Chinese design but this is stil a couple more years away. But Chinese consumers are becoming more aware of safety and environment so this will happen. Another thing Chinese brands must learn is the aftermarket, this is basically a non-existent concept in China.
Gary - regarding Chinese business culture, You are in my opinion correct. But, as You point out, this is ingrained in the culture, so why bother? My wife told me before we moved to China "-There is only one thing You can trust in China, and that is that You can't trust anyone", and "-If You are so stupid that You trust anyone, then You better suit Yourself". This has been my experience as well. Chinese people surely don't trust each other so why should You?
And this whole concept of "exploiting" the Chinese work force is baloney - cheap labor is what China has as unique selling point. Without this "exploitation", China's economic recovery would have taken even more time leading to more suffering.
To paraphrase Vaca Con Dios "-Boys, don't cry for the Chinaman, the Chinaman wouldn't cry for You".