Why do I earn less than you?
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Why do I earn less than you?
A young Cambodian blogger, Neilly Den, has asked what she considers a provocative comment on her blog today. What strikes me is not the naivety of the question but the stupidity of what look like some of the replies she got from expats she asked the question to.
http://neillydin.com/?p=234
I just don’t understand why Cambodians get paid way lower than expats for the same job. Firstly, I assumed that it was very unfair. However, I decided to the put the question out there and tried to understand from a different angles I received from the responses.
My question was: Am I being unreasonable if I demand to be paid equally as expats for the same amount of works I do?
Here are a few interesting responses I received:
Most migrants we have same salaries as Khmer but we pay everything more expensive a cause of reasonings as yours.
Personally I would prefer expats to be paid the same as locals. More disposable budget, more jobs, more training, more results.
If you paid expats the same as locals here, you wouldn’t have any expats.
I talked to people who said equal pay is the key and I talked to people who said it is not possible. I was also being asked what do I think create the wages difference between the locals and expats?
I am told for jobs in international NGOs or embassies, the wage needs to be competitive as the wage back home; otherwise, there wouldn’t be anyone wanting to work in Cambodia at all. Point taken, so, I assume that this also happen in every other countries. That’s fine.
How about jobs outside of those two categories? I still see a big gap between salaries. I personally experience it, and the difference is at least 100% of the wage for the same position. Then, another question came up: do we have the same level of skills and experience?
So, it seems like one question leads to another question and this topic has become a giant puzzles.
Considering all points I’ve heard so far, here’s what I think:
International NGOs and embassies have different salary ranges. So, don’t even bother questioning the difference in wages between the international and local staff. Point well taken. Outside these two categories of workplace, it’s all up to experiences and skills. Thus, it’s worth questioning. If the two people are doing the same jobs with the same amount of years of experience and get paid differently, something is not right.
For an argument saying that expats get paid more because they spend more here, I disagree. It’s a choice of lifestyle you choose and, to live expensively or cheaply here is entirely up to you. The purchasing power here is way lower than back home for expats. If you say that you spend more, I can also say that. People hire me because I am different. They say I can think differently from other Cambodians, but what they didn’t take into account is I also choose to live a different lifestyle than other Cambodians. My expat friends and colleagues find it easier to talk to me because I seem to understand them well. However, I am being paid as locals because obviously, I couldn’t choose where I was born.
To sum up, I just want to open a discussion and at least ask the question that many of my Cambodian peers don’t dare to ask or never thought of asking. To me, it is really frustrating seeing this happen and no one seems to take initiative of finding out why. Even though there is no solid answer to my question, it’s worth asking anyway rather than stay silent and accept whatever is given.
http://neillydin.com/?p=234
I just don’t understand why Cambodians get paid way lower than expats for the same job. Firstly, I assumed that it was very unfair. However, I decided to the put the question out there and tried to understand from a different angles I received from the responses.
My question was: Am I being unreasonable if I demand to be paid equally as expats for the same amount of works I do?
Here are a few interesting responses I received:
Most migrants we have same salaries as Khmer but we pay everything more expensive a cause of reasonings as yours.
Personally I would prefer expats to be paid the same as locals. More disposable budget, more jobs, more training, more results.
If you paid expats the same as locals here, you wouldn’t have any expats.
I talked to people who said equal pay is the key and I talked to people who said it is not possible. I was also being asked what do I think create the wages difference between the locals and expats?
I am told for jobs in international NGOs or embassies, the wage needs to be competitive as the wage back home; otherwise, there wouldn’t be anyone wanting to work in Cambodia at all. Point taken, so, I assume that this also happen in every other countries. That’s fine.
How about jobs outside of those two categories? I still see a big gap between salaries. I personally experience it, and the difference is at least 100% of the wage for the same position. Then, another question came up: do we have the same level of skills and experience?
So, it seems like one question leads to another question and this topic has become a giant puzzles.
Considering all points I’ve heard so far, here’s what I think:
International NGOs and embassies have different salary ranges. So, don’t even bother questioning the difference in wages between the international and local staff. Point well taken. Outside these two categories of workplace, it’s all up to experiences and skills. Thus, it’s worth questioning. If the two people are doing the same jobs with the same amount of years of experience and get paid differently, something is not right.
For an argument saying that expats get paid more because they spend more here, I disagree. It’s a choice of lifestyle you choose and, to live expensively or cheaply here is entirely up to you. The purchasing power here is way lower than back home for expats. If you say that you spend more, I can also say that. People hire me because I am different. They say I can think differently from other Cambodians, but what they didn’t take into account is I also choose to live a different lifestyle than other Cambodians. My expat friends and colleagues find it easier to talk to me because I seem to understand them well. However, I am being paid as locals because obviously, I couldn’t choose where I was born.
To sum up, I just want to open a discussion and at least ask the question that many of my Cambodian peers don’t dare to ask or never thought of asking. To me, it is really frustrating seeing this happen and no one seems to take initiative of finding out why. Even though there is no solid answer to my question, it’s worth asking anyway rather than stay silent and accept whatever is given.
I know I'm unloveable. You don't have to tell me. I don't have much in my life, but take it - it's yours.
I know of at least one cambodian female who was paid according to western executive norms. She also has a degree from a real university ( master's degree in the west) , speaks fluent english and french, and would give most barang a run for their money.
She recently resigned a 6 figure position to start her own business.
She recently resigned a 6 figure position to start her own business.
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Once Cambodians secure proper tertiary qualifications from reputable institutions that hammer critical thinking, maybe then this discussion can be taken seriously.
Haha - my money’s on Playboy
The expat replies she supposedly received show that the expats she knows are likely mentally handicapped.
She spends time to argue against a reply that no logical person would make in the first place.
Do you think the business owners like paying more of their own money for expats? So what is the reason they do it? Common sense lacking with this delicate little flower.
She spends time to argue against a reply that no logical person would make in the first place.
Do you think the business owners like paying more of their own money for expats? So what is the reason they do it? Common sense lacking with this delicate little flower.
"Those who can, do. Those who can't, teach. Those who can't teach, teach English."
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and she is in the .001% of Khmerslogos wrote:I know of at least one cambodian female who was paid according to western executive norms. She also has a degree from a real university ( master's degree in the west) , speaks fluent english and french, and would give most barang a run for their money.
She recently resigned a 6 figure position to start her own business.
I agree with this;
If you paid expats the same as locals here, you wouldn’t have any expats.
and i would add that most ( not all ) Barangs have experience which is what the big companies pay for,
BUT;
IF there were Khmers with the experience i'd still bet they would earn less,
same thing happens in Thailand
"We are turning into a nation of whimpering slaves to Fear—fear of war, fear of poverty, fear of random terrorism, or suddenly getting locked up in a military detention camp on vague charges of being a Terrorist sympathizer." HST
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Actually, case in point with your daughter Richard - if she spends a fortune investing in her education, then she is completely entitled to expect a return on that investment. You have to make a lot of personal and financial sacrifices to secure top quality education.
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spot on,Petrol Head wrote:Actually, case in point with your daughter Richard - if she spends a fortune investing in her education, then she is completely entitled to expect a return on that investment. You have to make a lot of personal and financial sacrifices to secure top quality education.
"We are turning into a nation of whimpering slaves to Fear—fear of war, fear of poverty, fear of random terrorism, or suddenly getting locked up in a military detention camp on vague charges of being a Terrorist sympathizer." HST
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What a load of pigshit. Just because she can pay to attend decent schools and university's doesn't mean she should be entitled to anything other than her admission.Petrol Head wrote:if she spends a fortune investing in her education, then she is completely entitled to expect a return on that investment.
How she uses those admissions to educate herself is much more important.
A simpleton can pay their way through university anywhere in the world. Hell, George W Bush graduated from Yale. Entitlement is for people without real potential.
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Well, that is your opinion G&t and you're welcome to it.Gin&Tonic wrote:What a load of pigshit. Just because she can pay to attend decent schools and university's doesn't mean she should be entitled to anything other than her admission.Petrol Head wrote:if she spends a fortune investing in her education, then she is completely entitled to expect a return on that investment.
How she uses those admissions to educate herself is much more important.
A simpleton can pay their way through university anywhere in the world. Hell, George W Bush graduated from Yale. Entitlement is for people without real potential.
Most of the worlds business, law, engineering or medical students would disagree I reckon.
Last edited by Petrol Head on Sat Aug 15, 2015 8:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Back on topic - another thing, until the Khmers understand the link between consistent, diligent study and success (not just students, but teachers, professors and administrators) this is a pointless debate.
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No, I would think most of the world got there through hard work, study and ability as opposed to paying their way through and then thinking they are entitled to the results.Petrol Head wrote:
Most of the worlds business, law, engineering or medical students would disagree I reckon.
You're opinion seems to be if you pay, you are entitled. The only people that would agree to that are wealthy simpletons.
You said it. I had to re read that "Most of the..." quote because I couldn't believe that was actually his opinion. Than the follow up, "Back on Topic" gave me a laugh too.Gin&Tonic wrote:No, I would think most of the world got there through hard work, study and ability as opposed to paying their way through and then thinking they are entitled to the results.Petrol Head wrote:
Most of the worlds business, law, engineering or medical students would disagree I reckon.
You're opinion seems to be if you pay, you are entitled. The only people that would agree to that are wealthy simpletons.
I have Khmer friends that make western wages (Not 6 figures but no complaints). I also met lots of Khmer's through business that I assumed would have been making descent cash. Why? because they could communicate and conduct them selves at an international level.
All my Khmer friends who are in the service industry or lower level white collar positions wouldn't last 5 minutes outside of Cambodia. The Cambodian economy is geared towards these people, not the former.
ExactlyPetrol Head wrote:Once Cambodians secure proper tertiary qualifications from reputable institutions that hammer critical thinking, maybe then this discussion can be taken seriously.
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